Teresa Yanaros | Leaving The New Age To Follow Jesus
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gH3iFimY700
Transcript source: YouTube captions

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without further ado we're gonna go ahead
and jump into today's podcast my guest
the much anticipated long-awaited Teresa
your narrows Teresa welcome to the
podcast how are you I'm good thank you
so much for having me true sake I'm
really excited to chat with you today
man a lots happened since I first
reached out to you probably a year ago
and you were very busy you were making
the rounds and doing a lot of stuff and
traveling and doing a lot of speaking
and stuff but I'm glad we were finally
able to make it happen and it's such an
honor to have you here with me on the
podcast
well it's primetime I think it's really
exciting that I'm getting to talk with
you you're my first interview and over a
year and I'm just really excited for
what we're gonna cover today for sure
let's just start here just kind of like
just a quick overview for those people
who are tuning in who have no idea who
you are just kind of give just a brief
overview of who you are what you bring
to the table we'll start there yeah
absolutely
my name is Teresa and eres my projects
divine frequency I'm on YouTube and
Twitter and I have a website as well the
divine frequency calm a little bit of a
background on me I was so my family
before I was born they were actually
stationed at
Bentwaters Woodbridge its twin bases but
they were stationed there during the
time of the Rendlesham forest incident
which is a mass UFO sighting that
occurred in 1980 I'm sure you guys know
about it it's world-renowned if you
don't go check it out and so I was kind
of born into a family where UFOs were
always being talked about when I lived
in Virginia I was raised Catholic and
our church our priest was giving a
sermon one time when all the statues of
Mary began to cry
and this didn't happen just once it
happened quite a few times it was in
Time magazine he exhibited the wounds of
Christ there were all kinds of different
miracles that were happening around him
so I was kind of raised in this
atmosphere of you know what's the bigger
picture here are we dealing with
secret technologies hid by the
government what's up with miracles you
know I was raised in a family where both
of my parents were very Catholic very
Christian and just accepted that these
things were a reality so it was a very
supernatural paranormal family by the
time I went to college I decided that
something I was really passionate about
was critiquing the images and messages
received through mainstream media
outlets I thought that it was kind of
crazy to think in our day and age there
were just so many messages that were
being subliminally seeded into our minds
that we just would blindly accept
because that's just kind of the
atmosphere that we were surrounded by so
I started developing this thesis I ended
up getting a bachelor's degree in
journalism and then going off into the
you know public sector and becoming a
professional and all that and then
around the age of 25 26 I think I was 25
I wanted more for my life I kind of
looked around me and thought this is all
a matrix it was one of those moments
where I'm like this is my life this is
you know there's got to be something
more for me I want to offer something to
the world other than just working in the
software industry which not saying
there's anything about that that's bad
it was just at that time in my life it
was a shift that I needed to go through
so I ended up quitting my job moving
across the country I started to get into
kind of some New Age spirituality I
started writing a book
I eventually published that book and
went on to public speaking and that kind
of catches you up just on a basic level
okay awesome
like and I want to give a shout out to
somebody here hang out in the chat Chris
Garner who during the school of the
Mystics two weeks ago said hey you might
want to check out Teresa and what's
going on with her right now it's like
what's happening and he's the one who
told me that she's kind of had a change
of heart and now she's being more
positive and more Bible oriented and
posting bible scriptures and and she's
kind of had a change of heart so I went
over and seen your channel and seen
there was a lot of changes and stuff
being made so shout out to Kris garner
so I guess the first question is what
happened oh it's such a huge question
well okay so I was raised Catholic and I
was very much involved in my faith from
from a core level I've always believed
in God I always knew there was a higher
power that resonated with me I felt the
presence of the Holy Spirit all of those
things were a part of my upbringing for
me when I was 16 and I was in college I
started to come in contact with
information about like the LGTBQ I don't
even know the phrase LGBTQ I think it is
but it started to really mess with me I
was you know researching the Catechism
and what do I really believe about
certain social issues that just really I
had a hard time reconciling and when I
got into conspiracy content it kind of
made me realize like I really need to be
careful with authoritarian belief
structures and so I started started to
sort of question the foundation of it
all because I was having certain you
know social justice questions then
moving forward I my dad actually gave me
a book on reincarnation and I started
getting into it was actually called
journey of souls and so I started
learning about reincarnation which kind
of led me into a new age kind of belief
systems and so I'm researching all of
that and I'm going well how does this
reconcile with Catholicism and to make a
long story short I ended up getting
really deeply involved in the occult I
started doing tarot readings I built a
tarot business
I was doing channeling I mean it was it
just kind of expanded into something
where I was involving myself in a world
of supernatural forces that I absolutely
couldn't control there's there are
forces out there there are powers out
there that as as humans we can't control
and what basically happened is I was
leveled out I mean it was like coming to
the realization that you know there are
things that we just can't control and
there are powers that can manipulate us
it was like I confronted this concept of
evil like we hear that the concept of
evil some people disagree that evil even
exists some people accept that evil
exists but they just don't really have a
personal experience with it in a way
that really allows them to fully
appreciate it and I'm not saying that I
even fully appreciate it all I can tell
you is my experience right we all have
parts of the puzzle here my perspective
isn't 100 capital-t truth I mean your
truth seeker right what's the point is
that what we all have perspectives that
we need to add into the pot so that we
can figure out what's going on for me it
happened in October of 2018 and things
were going really well for me my career
was just on the up-and-up I was working
with so many people collaborating
developing all kinds of multimedia
projects and I got way ahead of myself
there was one night in particular where
things had just started to crash around
me because of the occult forces that I
had and I had brought into my life
welcomed in my life which I hadn't known
I mean I was ignorant to all of this it
wasn't like I was saying Oh evil forces
come into my life you know it creeps in
slowly but it was like I was being
crushed by the weight of evil and I
remember at that moment I'm laying in
bed and at that moment I had realized
that I had been walking away from God I
had chosen to take a path that was self
worshiping it was ego
and it was prideful and it was greedy
all of these things that I wasn't aware
of it wasn't like I had an intention to
to go that path it just slowly but
surely started to happen and then all of
a sudden I'm like why am I so unhappy
why am I so unfulfilled what is that you
know and at that moment it was like I
felt like I was in outer space like all
the decisions that I had made to get me
to where I was I had done on my own and
I felt like a child I felt like a child
and I just cried out and at that moment
God came back into my life with a
wrecking ball force I cannot even
describe with human words what this
experience was like it was like my
entire perspective my whole framework of
reality shifted in an instant and he
started showing me all of the things
that were wrong with my current life I
praise God for doing this I mean I I
have no idea why I just feel really
lucky you know what I'm saying like I
just feel so humbled that in my time of
darkness there was there was hope for me
you know I wasn't abandoned in my
darkness humans can abandon other humans
but God will never abandon us God will
never abandon us when we humble
ourselves and we call out to God and we
just say hey I want you in my life I
want your presence in my life I want a
personal relationship with you God will
answer it comes down to that first step
of humility and realizing like I am just
a human and I need help and what
happened was I reached over from my
Bible and I opened it up and it was like
God just started baptizing me in the
word all of these things that I had
confusion about suddenly he was just
showing me passage after passage after
passage just showing me all of the
things that I had been wanting to know
they were there the whole time it was
kind of funny kind of I felt sort of
sheep and shut that moment were like
okay I had kind of been
getting all of this because I had had
some kind of incorrect
you know layers of incorrect beliefs
about the Bible and I honestly think it
had to take time for me this was a part
of my journey I had to get to where I
was before God could hit me over the
head with some truth you know it takes
some time sometimes and I became aware
of strongholds and the spirit of
delusion and he just started showing me
all of these things and just breaking
down these strongholds of lies in my
mind and I just started getting rid of
everything new I threw away thousands of
dollars worth of books and New Age
materials and I burned all my tarot
cards and it was just like slowly but
surely God was showing me what I needed
to do you know it's good
just some context really quick again for
the people who don't really know who you
are like the people you were rubbing
shoulders with you were like welcoming
to like inner circles of really big
names in the New Age community David
Wilcock huge you know was promoting your
work Corey Goode another big name I mean
there's so many more Jimmy Church and
some of these big guys who have
influences and would sell out
conferences and stuff like that kind of
like picked you up as a little buddy and
pushed you out there and then like you
were in the forefront of all of these
speaking engagements and speaking as an
expert and I can see how it happened
really fast and you're like wait what
did I get myself into like so so for a
lot of people who we mentioned those
names and they represent different
things to us again the name David
Wilcock 2012 enigma changed my life of
me seeking for some deeper things and I
was a Christian at the time but getting
into some stuff about the third eye or
listening to metaphysical conversations
about 2012 enigma around 2012 and that
changed my life and so he represents
something for me and a lot of other
people we look up to these people we put
them on pedestals you've rubbed
shoulders with them they tell you not to
meet the people that you look up to did
that kill some of the magic once you
were kind of welcomed into the inner
circle of like hey these are like
the guardians of this movement and they
have all this pool and not to say that
you know not not that throw anybody
under the bus or whatever but did it
kill some of the magic once you found
out that there were regular people type
deal it's a really interesting question
I've never been asked that before I I
didn't really I wouldn't necessarily say
I pedestal eyes to any of them I mean I
looked up to some of that I mean I guess
for me personally I didn't really
pedestal eyes any of these people so I
guess I have sort of a different
perspective on that but I will say that
when you're when you're around you know
influencers for me it was really
exciting because I have a lot of content
to offer and I have a lot of I just I
love collaborations and so for me I
think what it was I got kind of swept up
in the excitement of okay now what are
we gonna do we can do all this like
really cool stuff together and we can
create and we can grow and I was working
on you know getting my book published
and creating content to present at these
conferences which I you know I'm a
public speaker I have a background in
coaching on the corporate level in you
know accounting firms and stuff so it's
like for me it was really exciting to
have the opportunity to get on stage and
generate a community if people were for
me it is about truth seeking like that
is the whole reason why I started to do
what I did with divine frequency and I
mean that's the reason why I got a
degree in journalism and it's just who I
am it's it's embedded within me now I
think that to a certain extent some of
these people that we pedestal eyes like
sure they can be true seekers too but I
think we get into like a dangerous area
when we hold someone else's perspective
above our own and the reason why I say
that is because at the core the truth is
we each have a perfect divine connection
to our Creator therefore when we lift up
someone else's perspective above our own
we can start to negate our own
connection to God and and it creates
what I call an intermediary and this is
when you get into the gray area of
idolatry where you start putting wedges
between you and your Creator
so there's danger inherent in any of
that yeah yeah it sounds it sounds very
similar to my story you know what I'm
saying of just like having this 180
experience of being deep into the occult
and getting into a place where I
couldn't get myself out of and because I
was able to see these entities that I
was welcoming into my life like you said
slowly but surely you thought it was
good this is all love and light man
there's gods there's demons there's all
of these entities around you that want
to hang out and then you find out that
there's a lot of beings of darkness who
are cloaking themselves in light and
they don't tell you that one when you
get there but you find yourself in this
place of like wow I'm fighting for my
sanity in a place where just a couple
days ago I was fine right and just kind
of messing with your head so for me I'm
always there's a plumb line of like the
truth seeker again of like I'm looking
into so much different stuff or whatever
and there's always this this moment of
seeking truths many different troops
truths about the government truths about
conspiracy theories truths about our DNA
and our Anatomy and all of these
different troops have been hidden from
us right and we're seeking these troops
but if there's a difference of seeking
the truth which is Jesus and you had
this encounter who stepped into your
life and there's a difference that
people don't get that if they've never
had an encounter or if they've never
read the Bible and have it open up and
unfold and we're looking for these deep
mystical esoteric truths because we're
told in these spiritual communities in
new ways community the Bible is just
kind of like an elementary thing to keep
people under control and there's not a
lot it's been tampered with and it's old
and outdated so we need something new
but like we so we want something deep we
want something esoteric but the Bible is
the most beautiful the deepest book you
will ever read it's as you're reading it
it's like beholding in a mirror
were telling you about yourself the deep
secrets of your heart that's manifesting
it and you read the same thing but get
different revelation about what you're
reading each time and it's this
communion with your Creator through the
scriptures and so there's a reason why
the New Age movement or demonic forces
want to keep you away from that book and
say well Jesus was just another way he
was just a good man or a good prophet or
a miracle worker versus he is the truth
right and looking up to him as the the
truth in the Christ and you find out
even last week on our school of the
Mystics people were like name-dropping
all of these people that they were
listening to and getting into the
spiritual movement and hey what you
think about this guy in this guy and for
the most part I don't like the name call
I don't like to point fingers I'm like
hey if you're supposed to learn from
them God will teach you I kind of trust
the process but it's like hold on like
this jewel that you have this this a lot
of people are baby Christians as we
would call them when it comes to their
knowledge of who Jesus is and they just
have a piece of it and and in the world
can so easily corrupt that and so many
of these teachers and many of these
people in the spiritual movement when
you mention the name of Jesus they get
angry you need to call them Christ his
name wasn't do you have Ollie you can
mention booboo you Buddha you can
mention Babaji you can mention Krishna
you can mention all of these other gods
I'm in rah and all this kind of stuff
but when you mention Jesus they get
uncomfortable you know and they didn't
that their face changes it almost more
staid look like they took a bite of a
sour lemon I've dealt with it too I'm on
all these podcasts I interview them they
have me on their shows but so there's an
there's there's a there's a delicate
faith there when it comes to protecting
the intimacy with Jesus that a lot of
these people are trying to corrupt you
know and so we have to be careful when
it comes to seeking truths plural versus
seeking the truth and keeping the main
thing the main thing because it's so
easily fights for your time you know
when it comes to communion or coming
together to partake of communion the
scripture says over every time that you
come together
do this in remembrance of me I want you
to do this I want you to take the wine
detect and take the bread and I want you
to remember me why because this we so
easily forget what he's done we so easy
because you know we're not always doing
bad we're not always in this dark pit
where we're screaming out for a savior
sometimes we're doing good we feel like
we're on the mountain and so it's easy
to forget about you know even my
darkness is very similar to what
happened to you was in 2000 you know
September of 2000 I came back to Christ
and and I'm a it's been a long journey
I've been really good since then so it's
like I always need to remember that and
I think all of us do that we need Jesus
more today than we needed him in our
darkness and to always remember that
because even you moving forward they're
gonna be ideas and some of those old
ways hey come back we'll accept your
back it's okay we like we all make
mistakes and you missed the limelight
and all that stuff's gonna tempt you
it's happened to all of us just like
Satan pull Jesus to the top of the
mountain say hey all this can be yours I
know you turned your back on me but hey
you can have it I'll give you the
kingdoms of the world you know so we're
all tempted with that every single one
of us so your story's amazing I want to
get into it a little bit deeper but just
really jump in really quick I loved when
you were talking about conspiracy
content and how we're kind of all
seeking the truth here and there's a
question in the chat about lies and
deception and what I think is really
interesting is to consider that with
conspiracy content there's this land I'm
gonna be doing a whole video series on
this coming up this month there's a
whole kind of mentality or faction of
conspiracy people that follow conspiracy
content that are actually very paranoid
they become a addicted to this you know
they become addicted to this kind of
content and they become extremely
paranoid and I think this right here is
where you start to see lies and
deception because I think they
themselves are being deluded they're
becoming delusional and they're losing
touch with reality and this is something
that God was showing me through the
Scriptures very very initially like
early on when he started to to you know
kind of envelop me and His grace and
true
and as that was starting to come through
so for me I think what's really
fascinating to think about and this is
directly related to what you just said
is that we can feel this paranoia or
sadness or depression alleviate when we
understand that God has covered us and
he has made promises that he's kept and
he has made promises that he will keep
and we we are existing in a space of
imperfection we're in the time of
imperfection right now where we see in a
mirror dimly and reality is blurred but
then when the time of perfection comes
all of this will be wiped away and we
will see clearly we will see God and we
will know him fully as we have been
fully known by God and that to me was
such a piece that just permeated into
the fabric of my existence where it's
like okay any any level of doubt or
paranoia or frustration with what's
going on in the world yes we live in a
day and age where we can make changes
yes absolutely but there's a problem
when we get looped into this idea that
the more we do we can become spiritually
advanced and we can evolve like this we
love deception you get caught up in it
thinking that there's more and more and
more that you need to do personally in
order to be spiritually advanced or
evolved that's it's a lie it's a
deception it's not true you are exactly
who God major to be he wants to have a
personal relationship with you exactly
who you are there's nothing you need to
do nothing you need to eat nothing you
need to read no one you need to follow
period all you need to do is stop let it
all go there's so many distractions all
around you God wants to speak to you
directly and wants a personal
relationship with you and that is that's
your spiritual experience nobody can
take that from you and you know one's
gonna sell that to you you can't buy
that it's parent in your experience I
love it see that's the the beautiful
thing about the kingdom being within
what Jesus said hey the kingdom is
within you that we don't need anything
that they're selling us we don't need to
go to the event we don't need the book
you know and again people get addicted
to the content they want to know more I
got to find out more than there's rabbit
trails and things like that and things
that people are
you know follow in and then when you
look at like I mean I may have
contributed to some of this delusion you
know what I'm saying or whatever the
case is and so it's it's um you know the
Bible in its of itself is super deep
you know people but the thing about it
is let's talk about the Bob a little bit
more is like it says in Corinthians that
you have to be illuminated with the
light of the Holy Spirit to even
understand the mysteries that are in
that thing people pick it up and they're
like this is a book of control this is a
book of that but it's like when we pick
it up it lights up its ad if we're
reading something else we you start
crying like that's just a different
encounter that we have because of
goddess is is wooing us through the
infilling of the Holy Spirit and so
there's a difference there so we have to
like bring that to the table to awaken
by the message and the message is
awakened by the word of Christ let me
ask you this though so what when you
when you went through this deep
awakening in this return to your faith
in Christ and and God you were in a
relationship as well were you married at
the time or were you know I was divorced
back in - I don't even remember it's
like three years ago so when I met him
first yes I went through a divorce and
then that was it was after the divorce
that I went on to the conference circuit
and started meeting people and doing
public speaking okay so when you had a
change of heart and kind of like
couldn't be involved in some of the
things that you were promoting and some
of the partnerships and things like that
word you out it were you were was there
false news spread as I hey she's kind of
losing it right now
you kind of think they're worse people
slandering your name what usually
happens you know when you go through
something like that did that happen to
you or yeah I mean I'm not it's
interesting because there were a couple
of layers that happened it was like a
bomb went off in my life honestly I
think that you know it's interesting to
hear you say that when people have a
change of heart they're attacked and I'm
like okay that's that's interesting
because that's I don't even think that's
what I'd speery
I think that part of what I experienced
was because I left an authoritarian
belief structure I didn't realize that I
had gotten myself looped up in a UFO
new-age brand of excuse me basically a
cult and I know that that that word
triggers everybody and no one wants to
believe they're in a cult cuz you just
joined a church right that's right
exactly
well and you know the way that I say it
is like I can tell I understand that
people can think of this whole pendulum
swing thing okay she got scared she went
back and hid under a rock okay I get it
but the truth is that's not actually
reality this was a ladder climb and the
the more that I continued to put out
content I know that this will kind of
that will kind of come out so I'm not
really concerned about those allegations
but to answer your question directly
yeah i when I left this this group of
people it was it was crazy man I mean it
was like I was getting hit from all ends
yeah I mean there was definitely there
was libelous information being published
about me there were slander coming out
of people's mouths it was crazy but I
think that part of it is you have the
people that follow blindly maybe not
even they won't they don't want to say
blindly I have to be PC here people that
follow authoritarian belief structures
that really want to believe it and it
makes me wonder about like if you're
getting so angry about what you believe
maybe you should stop for a second and
ask yourself what that says about you
because if you're angry does that mean
that you're you're concerned that it's
gonna be false and you're gonna have to
let go of it you know what is where does
that anger come from because when you
have the truth that's a piece inside of
your heart you don't have to hold on to
it because it's just truth is capital-t
truth inherent it's it's there it's
constant it's not changing it's it's
ever-present
you can't get rid of truth because it's
truth it's it's all-encompassing so you
know seeing that people get so angry
because they for them they had placed me
in a certain position and when when you
put someone in a box and then they step
out of that box you get angry
get back in your box you're supposed to
be this person that I've created in my
mind that you are and when you show me
that you're not now I have to adjust my
own worldview to accept and incorporate
your new self into my worldview now I
don't think a lot of people could do
this so there was that and then there
were the people that ran this kind of
belief structure that were afraid of
what I might say that would get people
to go we'll wait a second wait a second
maybe this isn't the truth because they
themselves are beholden to their
viewpoints and they feed off of other
people believing what they're saying
it's a feedback loop it's a total
feedback loop so I get it you know I
have nothing but love in my heart like
it's like whatever my new mission is to
to go to that that nexus point where
people are coming into new information
and they're going how do i navigate this
truth-seeking journey with my feet under
me so because I've been tossed to and
fro I've been through some stuff myself
I've made my mistakes I'm not perfect I
am NOT a perfect person by any means I
don't hold anybody to that standard and
that's totally cool with me I'm ready to
move forward and in moving forward I'm
sort of incorporating some of that pain
into into me to to heal that through
helping other people who are coming into
their own truth-seeking journey at
whatever level they're at and they're
looking for people online to kind of
have that conversation with them which
as I know what you do which is awesome
and you know I'm just gonna continue
doing doing my thing you know one of the
things and it still bothers me to this
day and I've been I've dealt with it for
years but how did how did it make you
feel obviously I know how it made you
feel but it can mess with you when
there's like slander videos and exposed
videos and those things because you were
kind of targeted by different because
you were lumped in with Corey Goode and
those and David Wilcock and there's a
lot of people who whether they don't
like their information or don't like
their platform or whatever thing they
have then so you get kind of trickles
down to you too let's do a video on her
so there's a lot of you know videos and
you really
comment sections and it they get kind of
weird it still messes with me when I see
it maybe when it's from people who are
close to me because you deal with that
too and that you did but how did how did
you navigate through that did that
trigger anything of like oh wow all of
these videos coming out about me did you
watch any of them any of that kind of
stuff I think I want to say like
somebody like the dark journalist who
was very outspoken and project Avalon
and people who we've looked up to I've
looked up to those guys when I was
really into the movement and they've
kind of like not they but Avalon and
those guys have took taking shots at me
and stuff like that but it kind of
messes with you how did you navigate
through that kind of stuff cuz you're
still gonna get it now now you're gonna
get it II maybe even more now that now
you know this New Age return jesus-freak
or whatever the case is you know yeah I
mean I've I've had my fair fair share of
hate speech I have I deal with that on a
daily basis I think I'm just a really
triggering person somehow I don't really
understand it but yeah people really
want to hate me I think that part of it
is and I don't know if there are any
female content creators out there
watching but it's hard to do this as a
woman as a woman with curly hair and
lipstick on her face I mean seriously
it's like you get torn apart for
anything it doesn't matter what you say
you say one thing you do the other
either side someone's gonna hate you so
I've been dealing with that for so long
I mean that I mean yeah it definitely at
times gets to me it's frustrating but
it's all I mean it's never gonna end
it's not kind of just a bond into it or
it's just a facet of what you deal with
you know what I try to do is focus on
the people that actually get it actually
understand what I'm doing I think that
people want to assume that I'm like some
of the hate speech I get oh she just
wants attention
she is brainwashed and she you know
she's stupid she's unintelligent like
all these things that people want to say
when they on a surface level don't know
anything about me
I mean you can watch all of my content
on YouTube YouTube and still not know a
thing about me like I only highly
showcase certain things like there's
only certain information I'm gonna put
that out there on the internet you know
but I be honest authentic as possible I
try to be an open book I you know I
don't have anything to hide
I am authentic and I'm not unintelligent
by the way I try to have a balanced
perspective I have conversations with
people I actually talked to my
detractors those who are respectful I
mean if you could you go on to my last
two YouTube videos and I've engaged with
some people that had some criticisms and
I said hey that's a really good point
why don't we talk about that and we had
amazing conversations and by the end of
it they're going you know what I think
I'm gonna follow your content now like
the fact that you can meet me where I'm
at you know yeah project Avalon they
hate me over there you know I've seen
some of those threads and at times it's
been upsetting but you know I think that
ultimately people get on the internet
and they they feed on what they want to
feed on and it and it's it's to make
them feel however it is that they want
to feel so they're seeking out that kind
of information and if watching a video
of mine is gonna anger them and make
them want to call me ugly or stupid then
you know to each their own and love and
light to you and have fun commenting on
your forums about me yep yep it's that's
just what it is until they really want
to you know get to know you or but it is
cool when they come back and you get
those people who do kind of lash out in
like hey I was wrong or whatever well
there's like journalists like that you
know whenever I you know I went to
contact in the desert 2017 which is a
conference a UFO conference I met Corey
Goode and the rest of them and then
immediately I was being attacked on the
internet I was called a Satanist they
were saying that I was doing satanic
rituals in the desert and I'm going like
what so yeah I mean it was immediately
out the gate there relize being
published but that's all quashed I mean
that it's it's water under the bridge
you know like people thought that
because I was associated with certain
people I was a certain way you know and
I'm not saying that I'm perfect yeah
I've made my mistakes and I've learned
in the process and you know I've come
out on the other end of that and I'm
trying to move forward you know it's
really hard when you get a growed into
somebody else's content creation because
they have so many followers and then you
can't break free of that because
everybody wants to perceive you as you
know being associated with other people
but you know but all you can do is just
keep putting one foot in front of the
other and continuing to hang out with
the people who actually support you and
have a good support system and move
forward you know for sure which gives
out out to the moderators in the chat
anybody being mean or bad in the chat
y'all put them in timeout or block them
do your thing guys I give you permission
to do that come hail Satan stuff some
little weird you get I get that some
time to calm people flood the chats and
come over from twits and stuff like that
you know when I asked you about this
because this is a big one man that um
that you you mentioned in passing but
it's I think we always have to be aware
of this because you did it you mentioned
the pendulum right of the swinging back
and forth and so my process has been a
pendulum swinging and trying to find out
who I am and what that looks like and
what I'm able to do and and going back
and forth of like coming out of church
and then talking about aliens or talking
about you know the cosmos or whatever
there was just because I was a Christian
minister I was an evangelist telling my
story about how God saved me from the
darkness and things like that and did
that for many years but when I got into
2012 enigma some of the stuff I was
talking about it and then I kind of
received that scrutiny from the church
crowd so that mess with me and made me
feel like I was a black sheep and then I
would repent and like come back to say
hey I don't I don't you know because I
don't you know believe that stuff
anymore guys they would accept me back
like okay he's okay he's okay but if I
believed any of the the far-out New Age
stuff even if there was biblical backing
they didn't care they like associate you
so a couple years that I was just like
back and forth back and forth I mean
even in the same day it was driving me
mad
like trying to figure out who I was and
what it looked like and you can't be a
Christian to be in astrology you can't
be a Christian and do this or you know
or who would Jesus is to me now or
whatever the case is and so there's this
pendulum that goes back and forth and
we're here for one day the next day we
have a change of heart and you know what
I'm gonna try to make up to those people
I would do interviews with on new-age
shows and stuff and then I would message
them the next day hey can you take that
interview down no no and I would make up
reasons like hey I think that you know
what I'm saying
and they would be gracious enough to do
it and I've had people do it to me guys
come here talk about angelology and
contacting angels and then you know if
using sigil magic and stuff and then a
couple weeks later a year later hey can
you take that down when you google my
name I'm the first thing that wraps up
and so that up and I've had to change
the part I'm back in church now and so I
don't want that to be promoted so that's
part of it depend of them we have to be
careful because the pendulum can be a
wrecking ball and like you said like it
comes back in a Jif we burn bridges and
we're short with people we're saying
stuff that we can't undo you know what
I'm saying it's definitely part of the
process but I think that the narrow road
is really about balance and you find it
as the scripture says I really do think
it's about balance and so I want to
commend you but I want you to keep that
in mind too again like going back from
the beginning when I said like it's
gonna be those people reaching out hey
come on let's do this and like okay you
know and let's make amends and hey let's
do that I had a bunch of really close
friends in my life ministers and things
who we were really close with and
yesterday I just talked to one of them
the first time and I want to say three
four years maybe and it was off of some
exposing thing hey stay away from true
seeker true seekers there's true seekers
that and really went on this like attack
or whatever online and I was like okay
done with you cool and I finally made
amends and and accepted the apology and
that kind of thing and but it's all
about the pendulum like I seen the
pendulum in their life like they were
into what we're doing interviewing New
Agers and interviewing these people but
then it becomes overwhelming what the
hell am i entertaining I'm in a ten
people who were looking in the dark
magic or people who were looking into
the occult and I'm and they feel like
they're promoting it or whatever so it's
part of the process the pendulum in and
for everyone listen and they all have
their own experiences in their own
spiritual walk that they have to walk
out but I feel like do as little damage
as possible absolutely that you know
instead of far I'm doing a blog or video
because people will download you can
delete the video but people were
downloaded and re-upload it to the
channel and stuff you know it's so we
got to be careful about that stuff
definitely and that's a huge
confirmation for me I appreciate you
going through that and I totally agree
with you I couldn't agree with you more
when I left my social media back in
October of 2018 I pulled everything down
I pulled back hardcore I stopped
everything and it took me a year to come
back and through that time I was
researching hardcore man I was reading
so much I went to grad school at a
seminary first semester and I I mean I
was consuming so much content and it was
only December really of last year so
like a month ago that it clicked in a
way cuz I was like you know God I'm
letting you move in my life I'm not
making any moves until you tell me what
to do and I was just being still I'm
like I'm not I'm not touching this with
the 20 Cole until you tell me what to do
because I will make I will make mistakes
and I'm not saying I won't make any more
mistakes I'm gonna make plenty of his
face but and it's gonna be fun while we
do it right but back in December I
realized that all of what I had been
through and everything from my past it
wasn't that I needed to walk away from
it it was that I was being integrated it
was coming into this space of wholeness
that I didn't know existed and it was
fascinating to watch God do this with my
life I'm like oh okay I am I am whole
again it took it took a while but what I
what I found was that I'm actually
really interested in this nexus point
between the supernatural and the
paranormal realms or there's actually a
distinction between the two and I
started writing a book about it I'm
about halfway done with the book now
about 20,000 words in and what I think
is really interesting is that you
it's a paranormal which is like your
normal abilities like psy abilities
things that we just have the ability to
do that's unexplained so this is this is
just a natural physical occurrence right
then you have the supernatural this is
beyond the physical and there's a nexus
point and there's an overlap between the
two of these circumstances like you have
like the phenomenon that's supernatural
which is beyond the physical that can
come in and interact with the paranormal
like dreams or psychic abilities and
everything that's supernatural is by
default paranormal because it's
unexplained and it will always be
unexplained because it's beyond the
physical
now the paranormal isn't always
supernatural because it could just be
something naturally occurring that we at
some point will be able to explain so
what I think is really interesting is
where is what the Bible says about this
like in my book I'm going into like
laying the foundation of like systematic
theology of what the Bible says about
things like angels demons supernatural
beings all of that and then I'm going to
shift and the second part of the book
that I haven't written yet that I'm
doing a lot of research for currently is
let's start talking about certain things
that happen in our lives that we have
some kind of paranormal experience or
you know phenomenon that's occurring and
then but what what if there's a
supernatural force coming into that
right and there is these are things that
we don't know we can guess we can assess
our our circumstances our our
experiences and come together as a group
and go like what does this mean what
could this mean you know and we can try
to figure it out
we'll never know but it's really
interesting and it cut it I think you
stole my book idea that's what I did
that's what I did with my book you got
it no like it's the exact same thing and
I think it's the Spirit of God letting
us know like hey we need to get this
information out but we have to you know
there's certain people I wanted to talk
to you and and and hopefully just kind
of see where you were headed with this
and where your spirituality is in Christ
and so for me I feel like in the book
talks about it a lot is that like like
the Mystics of old the Saints the
prophets the seers the disciples were
very spiritual
people and again a lot of the stuff that
we talk about new age again you did
videos about God speaking through the
dream state and the Bible is full of
examples were like like exclusively go
to sleep and I'll talk to you go into a
trance close your eyes be still and I'll
speak to you all of us have to put our
heads on our pillow at night and we
can't run from the voice of God dealing
with this and we all have to deal with
that and there's so many supernatural or
paranormal stuff that happens within the
Bible and how do we reconcile it to the
faith the thing about it is the New Age
movement has come in and kind of
hijacked a lot of the things I think are
our birthright as sons and daughters of
God and even as Christians as believers
in Christ that we were told we can't
even the word trance is taboo for a lot
of Christians but it's all throughout
the Bible in a positive light God
speaking with the casting of lots and I
mean so many just leaving their bodies
and going to Paul went to the third
heaven and encountered things that it
was not permissible to for him to even
speak of like even if he tried to tell
you what he's seen he would be doing a
bad job and all of these beautiful
mystical encounters that we've kind of
given to the new age and so a lot of a
lot of people in the church they'll have
these encounters with a ghost or with a
past loved one or with an ancestor or
something in a dream state and they ask
the pastor about it and they can't they
don't know what to tell them they say
hey stay away from it it's demonic but
it's like this stuff's in in the
scriptures and so they leave the church
looking for answers and most of them
don't come back because they're not
reconciling it to their faith and I
think that definitely my calling you
know what I couldn't agree more it's
like you you have this discrepancy or
this this argument that shouldn't be an
argument where you have people on one
side looking at people in the church and
they're they're speaking different
languages like a different language but
there really needs to be a meeting of
the minds but I think a lot of I don't
even want to use the word Christians
because I don't want to start you know
throwing throwing I mean there are
people out there that want to call these
experiences evil when
that's not the case and what I think is
really interesting is that as soon as I
came out as a Christian everybody
assumed everyone was like okay she's
she's just brainwashed and she thinks
this is all evil and is it because I
didn't even know until this conversation
that's why I wanted to have it right and
it's it's interesting to me that it's
like you say one word and everyone's
like oh they have it all figured out cuz
you've said one word and it's like wow
you have no idea you have no idea
anything about me and what I've been
through I say one word and you decided
that you you have it all figured out and
and we need to be able to to have open
conversations and you know I have no
judgement I have no judgment in my heart
to hurt anyone you know I say Christian
and they go okay she's gonna be judgy
and it's like you've got the wrong idea
because I'm not judging anyone I have I
have so many questions and I'm gonna
keep going and that's okay and there's
nothing wrong with that and and I I
think that you know to speak directly to
what you're saying
I agree with you there are a lot of
people that didn't get the answers that
they needed inside the church and so
they've thrown the baby out with the
bathwater they go oh it's all wrong it's
we can't obtain anything true out of
this because of their experiences with
people who don't know what to say back
to them it's like yeah if Christians had
a response to the conversation that is
clearly happening and it's becoming
scientific we're gonna you know
Christians are gonna completely miss the
mark
they're already missing the mark on on
this particular facet of truth-seeking
and so you have those of us trying to
pioneer it where it's like okay how do
we create this conversation how do we
create a safe space where people aren't
gonna think like I'm gonna step into
this arena and immediately get called a
heretic you know it's it's just well it
controversial it happens but I will say
this and I've been talking to a lot of
Christians and I'm runnin out is so
weird because the stuff that we were
persecuted for back in the day of
talking about this stuff or whether it's
astral travel or leaving the body or
going into trance or the chakras or
anything like that
now with these are conversations that
are being had in and many not all
obviously but many Christian communities
and there's movements of people that I'm
a feel
with shout out to Gil Hodges and Kingdom
talks and I want to get you linked up
with them as well that you do awesome
interview with those guys but they're
into encountering God through the
mystical realms of just looking back
throughout the scriptures of of how they
did it there and also stepping into the
next stage which they're really big into
but there's a lot more Christians having
the conversation now about this kind of
stuff and and open to it and not just
having the conversation but they're
going after it they're engaging it
they're leading group meditations where
they're encountering verses like let's
do a meditation and go talk to an angel
or let's do a meditation where we go
talk to the ET cela hold on let's do a
meditation let's get quiet and ask for
Jesus to come up and show up and ask for
Jesus and I feel like it's so awesome
these experiences that they're having in
people's lives are being changed because
it's real and so you know don't anybody
listen and just be don't be afraid to
have the conversation because it's
definitely being had with or without you
now and stuff that again like as a
forerunner back in the day was
persecuted for a lot of this stuff now
it's open conversation the work that we
were doing it are paying off because we
were vocal about it you know even in the
new-age community like reconcile is
reconciling Christians to the spiritual
realm but reconciling New Agers back to
Christ look he loves you he wants to
engage you and have a relationship with
you and he's not mad at you and his love
is is deeper than any ocean and it's
taller than any mountain and you can
encounter that in the privacy of your
own home and it's the most beautiful
mystical experience that you would ever
have and not trust me in the book I've
talked about many UFOs aliens spirits
fairies all of these things that I
believe in it did there exist on some
level none of them hold any par any
stick to an encounter with Jesus or even
just a revelation of who he is the most
beautiful of love became a person and
walked among men and we can encounter
that and he longs for us to hang out
with them there's nothing more deep or
spiritual than that and
and that's what the message should be
and I'm right I want to hear about your
encounters with Jesus and and one of
these beautiful encounters to just being
in the midst of darkness like it takes
that contrast right like you wouldn't
know what you wouldn't be able to see
how beautiful he was unless you were in
the darkness that you were in you know
and he came came in to save you you know
right and I think that to speak to what
you're saying though it's like yeah I
think a problem is that when you take
yourself out the you take you think you
can take yourself out from underneath
the authority of God what you can't what
you think you can so you you step out
you go out you know I'm gonna rebel I'm
gonna be disobedient I don't I don't
believe in God or I don't want God in my
life or whatever it is that you say and
maybe because you're mad at the church
you've been you know wronged by someone
maybe you had an experience and you know
the priest told you that that it was
evil or something so now you don't want
any authority so you're being
disobedient so you're going off the
rails the completely other way talking
about the pendulum swing right and now
you're letting all of these evil forces
into your life because you have decided
that you're going to completely just be
as disobedient from any kind of truth
you you're stepped into the lie you've
used pendulum swung away from your
direct connection to God and so what I
think is important is to talk about
dangers like there are dangers inherent
in these kinds of any kind of spiritual
practice you can you can let in
deception and lies so what I think needs
to happen is there needs to be an okay
way to have that conversation because I
think people that have had bad
experiences with Christianity gets super
triggered at any kind of mention of
danger they oh oh that's fear-based oh
that's fear-based thinking and it's like
okay but fear isn't actually a bad thing
I mean you you're afraid as a child so
you don't touch the candle and burn your
hand you know what I'm saying like we
need to
be able to have a deeper penetrating
conversation about these things without
immediately assuming that there are you
know agendas behind those statements it
should be perfectly fine to say that
there are dangers inherent within
spiritual practice that should be okay
I should be able to say you know what I
think it's i think Tarot is evil I
should be able to say that you know I
think it's a slippery slope you're
opening yourself up to potentially evil
supernatural forces okay that I believe
is true so you know if someone wants to
get mad at me because they think I'm
calling them evil no I didn't say that
you're evil for using Tarot those words
never came out of my mouth you know
let's let's not get confused here and
straw man let's let's let's go okay well
why do you think that and have that
conversation but people don't want to
have conversations they want to jump to
conclusions and then nobody's actually
getting anywhere closer to the truth
because they want to argue yes yeah I'm
with you I think for me and what what I
kind of teach is that like none of I
don't think that any of these things are
like evil in and of himself they're just
tools you know and how do you use them
why are you using them why are you
trying to get this secret knowledge
secret knowledge is cool there's a way
to get it in the scriptures tell you he
says Jeremiah 33:3 come on you don't say
if you if you come unto me and and and
and and seek me I will show you things
that you do not know and cannot find out
that God is saying if you seek me I'm
gonna show you things that are gonna
blow your mind beyond your wildest
dreams
don't go outside of me don't go into
these these far out books that are made
up by out of the minds of men like there
is a bunch of beautiful things that God
God he puts the hunger within us to like
seek out the deep and things right it's
in us for a reason when we try to run
from that then there's the pendulum well
am i running from the occult stuff I'm
drawn to the hidden things well there's
a writ as a way to do it it's through
God and not outside of him and anytime
we try to go outside to do that that's
what we find ourselves in trouble
because I think that when it comes to
idolatry there are dangers inherent with
with using physical objects that comes
between you and God I think that seeking
the face of God doesn't necessarily mean
you need a physical object that
can draw supernatural attention to it
it's like what you start doing instead
of talking to God directly you go and
you pull your tarot deck out and you
start thinking you're talking to God
through a tarot deck you know initially
when I started reading Tarot I thought
okay it's not really anything magic this
isn't woo woo I'm just you know
memorizing definitions on a card and I'm
using it as a creative tool to assess my
circumstances or whatever okay so that
right there there's nothing magical
about that right there's nothing wrong
with that but the problem is there's a
slippery slope here because what starts
to happen you could we all have insights
we have our own physical side ease and
so that's there and then you start going
further and then all of a sudden you
start getting information that you know
isn't from you where did that
information come from did it come from
God why would God give you good
information through a tarot deck if it's
going to take you away from God and make
you thinking that the tarot decks gonna
give you answers that's idolatry that
there's no way that God would be like oh
let me give you some godly answers
through the tarot deck so that you can
ignore me and just go off with you too
you see what I'm saying you're opening
yourself that was always the rebuke for
any of that stuff throughout the Bible
right when it came to astrology we see
God rebuking astrologers we see God
rebuke in the stargazers he's like
you're gonna look at the Stars but
you're not gonna be able to read them we
see God rebuking the worshipers you're
gonna sing your songs I'm not gonna
listen it's gonna be like clanging
cymbals and loud breaths I don't listen
to your your your worship songs anymore
so so do we like read that and think
that God doesn't inhabit the praises of
his people anymore that God is not moved
by adoration when we lift up a boy
sinseong and worship him no it's like
when you when your heart is wrong it's
the motives in whether it steroid or
something like that I'm not really
speaking about that for me it's more of
the inward things of again that we don't
need anything even tarot cards are just
something that exists outside of
ourselves there may be the tools that
I'm speaking of our prayer meditation
trance those kind of things are like
inherit you don't need anything outside
of yourself if you pray
there's nothing evil about prayer unless
you're praying to a demon right unless
you're if you're trying to conjure up
demon there's nothing there's nothing
you know I'm saying you you could take
the you
you the intention makes it evil and it
comes back to like the scripture saying
Father forgive them for they know not
what they do for but yeah I mean so the
whole thing for me is like trying to
like we got a give warning be careful
there's a lot of stuff out there a lot
of people there's the phrases and things
that we can mention and people just fall
on the crazy rabbit trails right but at
the same time I don't want to stifle
exploration like what happened to me
stale everything is demonic because with
my position your position and many
others who who are out there who have
bigger platforms and then I do and I'll
just say their name to the noted people
Steve and bang cars and the other angel
card lady they're like anything Doreen
Virtue
anything supernatural is demonic
anything outside of the bible is demonic
and that's simply not true again i feel
like like we're like forfeiting our
birthright when it comes to supernatural
abilities again the things you're
looking into the you know what what they
would call in a new-age ESP extrasensory
perception why when i stand next to this
person i can feel what they're going
through why do i know what this person's
why would I sit you know standing next
to this person I know what they're
thinking I know what they you know
there's some crazy stuff but then we
it's in the Bible like there's examples
all throughout the scriptures of how
like Jesus would look at someone and he
knew stuff about her we'll say well that
was just Jesus okay let's look at the
disciples they did it to like they would
know things about people and it's a word
of knowledge and a word of wisdom
obviously it's not called ESP or psychic
abilities in the Bible it doesn't use
that verbage but word of knowledge word
of wisdom or quickening in the spirit
that a download from heaven revelation
things like that that we we look at
Christianity and we're like they looked
at something as elementary and so with a
look at Hinduism or Buddhism or any of
these isms and as something deeper or
more
evolved and when you mentioned Jesus its
laughed at or scoffed out or whatever
the case is you know mm-hmm
yeah I think it's interesting bringing
up some of the other content creators
that were new-age to Jesus and how it's
almost this this new archetype yeah it's
this new archetype of content creator
that we're seeing
I guess generationally and so I watched
a recent video by Stephen banned cars
about the evils of yoga and about how
when you put your body into certain you
know positions you're channeling the
Hindu demon associated with like
whatever pose like I guess they were
saying one of the demons was murdering
someone and then you're putting your
body in that pose or something and I was
having a conversation about this with my
mom actually because I'm like you know
as far as that kind of content I
personally am NOT interested in making
that kind of content it's not really my
bag but at the same time it's like we
all have different voices we are all
speaking into different things right and
we have different audiences because the
people that were speaking to depending
on where they're at like what we say is
gonna be useful to them or not and on a
spiritual journey I think someone just
said this in the chat you know we're all
at different stages and we have
difference and then when I say stages I
don't mean this is like hierarchical
it's more like we're focusing on
different aspects of the truth and so
for someone like Stephen ban cars his
video on this for him for someone like
Stephen who's gone through the
experience that he's gone through you
know he ran a very successful New Age
blog he researched this stuff in depth
he knows all about the Hindu gods and
you know their different mythologies and
stuff like that so for him he has a
level of understanding where he probably
shouldn't engage in yoga because for him
he has gone through what he's gone
through he is who he is he went New Age
to Jesus he went hardcore New Age went
hardcore Jesus now he's like this is
probably something I shouldn't engage in
now calling out and I guess I need I'm
saying this out loud because I've been
reflecting on this lately and I know
that I've been talking about Tarot in a
certain way so it's sort of like his
talking about doing yoga is sort of
by talking about and so like and I know
that I'm gonna be doing a probably a
whole series on Tarot so that I can
express the full breadth of my opinions
here because I think I've been strong
and and people are kind of putting me
into a certain category now I don't want
to do the same thing to Steve and I'm
simply bringing this up because I think
it's interesting to discuss yeah what
about this you have people who are just
doing yoga because they want to stretch
right and Steve and even brought that up
in the video okay but his argument to
that was okay yeah that's fine you think
you're just gonna stretch but you're
actually doing these positions that God
doesn't want you to do because he wants
you praying to him and you're actually
praying to a Hindu God by putting your
body in these positions whether you like
it or not so there's a level of
ignorance that doesn't mean that it's
innocence you know it's kind of where
Stephens coming from but the way that I
look at it is like I mean it's a big
question we all can have a different
perspective here but it's like you know
I think that for someone like Steven
telling everybody it's good to have the
warning it's good to say hey this is
what's going on and this is this here's
the information of what of you know my
perspective I think it's important for
us to say like this is my perspective
this is what I've been through and like
parroting this back to Tarot it's like
for me I just want to let people know
about the dangers of it because of what
I've been through and how I've seen the
slippery slope and I've been on the
other end of it and I see how you let
the supernatural beings into that arena
so there's a level of when you've
engaged in the occult and you see the
the results of magic and you see the
signs and you see the wonders you start
to ask yourself who is who can I assign
the sign in one or two is the sign and
wonder to God or is this I no wonder to
something other than God so it becomes a
big question and I do think that when we
try to have more of an open perspective
about it which I know that I'm gonna try
to get better at because I know that
when I came out against arrows like this
cable and I do believe that it's evil
but I believe that for a certain reason
you could take three words and a lot of
people can feel a different thing about
those different three words and so I
want to have a little bit of grace here
for people like Stephen and and Doreen
and all these other content creators who
are trying to present their perspectives
and and they're doing it amazingly and I
appreciate the work that they're doing
because
probably bringing a lot of people to
Christ which is amazing I think that if
we are a little bit nuanced and I'm
gonna try I have to try to get better
about this too but if we can just try to
be more nuanced and say like this is a
perspective I'm bringing into the
conversation and let's let's be open to
other people's perspectives because when
you start hammering down like this is
you know my red flag goes up my spidey
senses go up like we just need to be
able to say like look this is what I'm
saying but I'm also I want to hear what
your thoughts are not because I want to
be rocked and I'm gonna change my
opinion but like that we all have
different pieces of this puzzle into a
larger conversation going back to the
pendulum again I'm sure you know there's
things for you obviously it's terrible
right now I'm sure it's other things too
but when I when I came out of like the
dark occult stuff and like I couldn't be
able around anything like if somebody
lit incense around me because we used to
because incense was part of our ritual
we would burn incense to other gods you
know what I'm saying and so when I came
out of that I was just so sensitive to
anything
somebody lit incense I'm like I gotta go
I got in it with it would trigger me it
because I was hurt and I was cut it
would trigger me and remind me of that
stuff I mean there's not an end to where
do we go to get away from the pagan tree
of the other nations and the other
cultures and stuff again you know you
kind of you have to pick and choose and
people will say are you not supposed to
pick and choose with the Bible it's we
all do and when we don't know what we
don't admit to it the Bible says don't
mention the name of any other gods out
of your mouth and I've already mentioned
three or four it said don't even let
that that don't even speak their name
and to exist don't acknowledge them we
have already said their name and then
that you know the days of the week
Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday
Thursday is Thursday
Fri all of the days of the week are
named after pagan gods in the months of
our calendar so it's like well how far
of this holiness or sanctification do
you want to go to like I'm not gonna I'm
not gonna mention the name I'm only
gonna say the number and then numbers is
numerology is 13 I'm not gonna say it
today because it's Friday the 13th
rootstock the patients were here before
the Christians in Hebrews were people
the names of our cars the names of our
streets are named after all of this
stuff and we don't even know it so it's
like people are sensitive though they're
like so you have to kind of get to where
like you know because they're all the
Watchmen who was like again everything
or everything's demonic the devil has
you know he's got it all and so that but
the scripture says the earth is given
into the hand of the wicked but the
earth is the Lord's and the fullness
thereof right so there's definitely a
balance and I've definitely had to come
to balance in maybe doing the right
knowledge and understanding of what does
the Bible say about incense okay the
priest would burn incense and offer
prayers up to God to Yahweh you know and
so it was a sin it was a symbol of the
smoke even's symbolically carrying their
their prayers and looking at a lot of
things that I came out of because they
were a new age in demonic oh hold on
this is in the Bible and we just gave it
or we're giving it to the new age or to
the Satanists or to the Buddhists we if
you mentioned meditation to a Christian
they're freaking out you met it because
their mind goes to Transcendental
Meditation Buddhist meditation spirit
guide
you don't say meditation as I hold on
the Bible says that were supposed to
meditate on the word the sit in silence
Jesus would go away for hours and seek
the father and meditation and prayer and
he would have these encounters man and
and so I'm trying to take it back man
it's interesting I love your story I
love it I can't wait to learn more about
you because I feel like you and I have
just hours of content to cover it's like
it's interesting to think about God
revealing himself to you like as you
went through your shift and you were
coming out and you did the pendulum
swing and you're going like okay now I'm
paranoid about even saying a day of the
week what's beautiful is that God
because I remember hitting that point
like after my conversion my really
intense conversion and I'm going like
okay I've got a really like start
foundationally from I like your mug
start foundationally from the ground and
really like learn how to rebuild you
know how I'm gonna walk forward and
what's really cool about that is
God will show us things God will reveal
to us personally each one of us which is
just beautiful and incredible that
that's a truth like a pat in the chat
what's up Pat you said your life as an
experience made just for you right so
God is gonna speak to you directly and
let you know what you need to know at
that time like we don't have to be
paranoid we can just sit in the
stillness of our heart and go okay I
trust I trust that God is going to show
me what is right for me and and God will
reveal himself to us at every different
stage of our lives it's like for me in
my conversion it was like I was able to
get rid of and just just just 86 out of
my life so many things that were
standing in between me and my direct
connection to God so that's awesome and
well and I can tell that story and I can
express that what I've been through to
other people now someone else might be
at a stage in their life where their God
is revealing himself to them in a
different way maybe it has nothing to do
with anything that I went through
maybe God's revealing himself to them
through you know their relationship with
their husband or wife yeah you know what
I'm saying and so like we can we can
meet each other and speak into each
other's lives in ways that click and God
can work through us to help other people
and as we're walking this journey being
open to there being other lanes and
respecting that people are in their
lanes it's it's only gonna help us I
think refined the conversations where
does for you where does the Bible come
into that though because you're gonna
get that in like the Bible is on the
back burner again it's outdated you know
it's a copy of Mesopotamian writings and
it's a it's a plagiarism of the Sumerian
tablets and stuff from Hinduism and in
Egypt
Egyptology you know it's a short the
Allah so the Bible is just kind of like
you don't need the Bible you just need
to go within and find God so where does
Jesus and we're not cuz you gotta love
the Bible in with Jesus not the Christ
you know everybody but Jesus himself
Yeshua whatever you want to call them
the the Messiah what does that fit in
with hey God speaks to me I'm not
convicted by tarot cards I'm not yeah
you know there is that the plumb line
for you do you are you still gonna
filter
those experiences and things through the
through the scriptures and stuff like
that yeah absolutely I think it's really
interesting like I went so I went to
seminary for a semester and I took a
course in church history and I took a
course a course called spiritual
formation and then I took a course where
we were looking at culture and the Bible
and Christianity it was fascinating and
I guess what's really been interesting
to me lately is to go back and look at
some of these content creators that are
in the New Age that are like super
popular and then look at what they say
about the Bible and it's like oh yeah
well they are wrong like it's it's crazy
to see like when you don't study
systematic theology you don't study
hermeneutics you're not actually like
studied and coupled with you haven't
read the Bible with an open heart as a
child you're gonna there's gonna be so
much that you're gonna miss that and I'm
not acting stuck up here I'm not saying
that I know everything oh you know at
all
now I've had personal experiences with
Christ through the Bible so I mean
there's there's an experiential level
that I can speak to that again is my
experience that I will not throw in
anyone's face that's just the reality of
my personal relationship with God I do
love reading the Bible I any given point
I just not right now because I'm I just
set my studio up but usually at any
given point I've got a Bible within
arm's reach
I have so many different versions of the
Bible I've got a concordance I love
looking into the original languages when
I'm researching and you know the book
that I'm writing really goes into
etymology and all of that and it's just
it's so much fun and it's fascinating
and like you were saying earlier the
layers of truth in the Bible it's it's
so amazing when you when you go through
an experience where you realize some
extra layer that you didn't see before
and you're going like this is just it's
a perfect the design is just so perfect
that you you can see how God is
revealing himself and and it's it goes
deeper and it goes deeper and deeper
it's it's been a really fun journey so
far and I look forward to you know more
and you know
collaborating with other Christians like
you and and getting to just really
experience more of that as a community
which I've grown to have in the last
year and I know that that's only going
to expand and and everything like that
what about you what's your experience
with the Bible oh yeah that's it I mean
it's the plumb line I mean obviously
there's probably some some things that
are a little bit gray in some areas or
whatever and but it's like in for me you
know it's all about love and I'm gonna
notice you posted the head on on Twitter
all these love beams and posts and stuff
like it's about love because Jesus's
love the Bible says God is love for God
so loved the world that he gave and so
whatever it's done out of love even with
the New Age community that's kind of
like our that's what links us like I'm
not linked to someone because of their
religious beliefs I'm linked to someone
by and I'm drawn to someone by their
love that the love that they have one
for another jesus said they would know
that you're my disciples by your love
for one of one for another it's not
because we have the right scriptures or
what is your stance on Trump you know
there's a lot of people they want to
know my stance on trunk to know if I'm a
Christian or not so hold on no no it's
about my fruit that's how we judge
people by their fruit what what is the
fruit that they're producing so for me
the Bible is the plumb line which has
led me to tear the Bible up and really
research it and find out there's some
interesting beautiful esoteric occult
meaning hidden knowledge in the Bible
and we don't have to go outside and look
at well you can but whatever you're
learning filter it through the Bible is
it the Bible promoting it and you find
that there's a lot of stuff in there
they were having angelic encounters but
they said hey don't worship the Angels
you know what I'm saying don't don't um
you know let anything corrupt you from
your faith why are you now preaching
about angels and you used to preach
about the cross of Christ and it has the
ability to set you free from a life of
sin and and and and in darkness and
stuff and so for me it's always because
we always like it's trying to find that
that middle passage and and the narrow
road and it's hard to walk it because
it's it's all that you see the all
Christian or all new-age or all
want to use the word new-age because
this is very old stuff that we're
talking about when it comes to the
Scriptures anyway there's a there's an
inheritance that we have so I try to I
try to use the Bible as a plumb line
again there's uh in my book like I just
I try to give you my personal experience
with some of this stuff and then some
biblical examples of stuff that we've
never heard about that that is amazing
beautiful things in the Bible that we
need to hear more about it and I'm not
the only one there's a lot of more
people waking up to this and doing it
and it's a I've kind of been I've always
been a forerunner but then when it
catches on it's like when you have a
favorite band you know oh this is a band
that I found and nobody knows about this
band and now they're huge twenty one
pilots or something now they're huge and
they're teeny boppers nothing I don't
listen to him anymore
you know now it's popular or football
team that was like the underdog then
they won and uh I rode with them because
they were the underdogs right and so
I've been that way when it comes to you
know my my experiences and knowledge of
the Bible and things like that and then
once it's caught on
I found myself like trying to abandon
and hold on we've been working hard to
have this conversation don't don't
because this depend alum run away go the
other direction you know so there's a
healthy balance there and um it's a lot
more people having this conversation
it's interesting and the first thing and
it but the funny thing is is like and
not to be in a private or arrogant way
but to understand that God was working
on those people at the same time all
over the world you know this whole
global awakening or spiritual awakening
other people were having it too and they
were Christians and they were reading
their Bible and they were studying this
stuff and now I'm seeing all of these
content creators and book writers and
courses created about the same thing
that I've been talking about for years
so it's awesome to see like an awakening
happening within the Christian realm as
well and they're not abandoning their
faith in Jesus in the revelation of the
cross and what it can do for someone's
life yeah and it's beautiful how you
talk about love how it all comes down to
love because kind of to tie a whole bow
on this whole conversation it's like
we've been talking about authoritarian
leadership and belief structures and how
that can become corrupt
with deception and when you think about
authoritarian structures there is a
power that's a stranglehold right that
is going to put a stopper hold on the
truth so well who do we look to who is
our authoritarian leader right and what
does that mean you've got authoritarian
leaders on the planet now where you see
pride greed ego corruption but if you
look at Jesus Christ and you look at
what he did what was the design it was
through servant leadership he gave
everything he gave he gave God gave you
said God gave it's like it's a total
shift in perspective entirely and the
freedom comes from that we are that
created and that there's there's nothing
else but that were the created and we
have this beloved relationship with our
Creator who has covered us and the
design is perfect and we don't have to
fret we don't have to stress we don't
have to be paranoid we've we don't have
everything figured out but a core level
work covered and we are loved and the
only reason we can love others is
because that is God revealing his love
to us and us being able to reveal that
love to others through him who created
us mm-hmm yeah it's so it's so beautiful
but I'm with you it's all about love
again that's that's what we're known by
and nothing else you know people have
the Creed's and you know you you know
other things connect you because you're
like a fan of the same team or something
like oh we're from the same state you
know it's like I'm connected because
I've learned to be able to see that
fruit of love and in other people who
are even outside of Christianity heck
for the most part I'm outside of
Christianity I don't believe the
majority of like church doctrine here in
the Bible Belt you know and we talk
about any of this stuff and I'm out it
so they don't you know that doesn't that
even the term Christian doesn't you
no I don't even like 100% identified
with that the only thing that really
links me to that is knowing that that
Jesus is the way the truth in the life
and no man comes to the Father but by
him and but understanding that there are
like his Grace's is far beyond
Christianity you know absolutely but
through Christ you know what I'm saying
in his love abounds through just love
itself and and people are following that
it's it's really deep it's beautiful but
to be able to see him in all things to
see Jesus and all things to see love in
all things and to be able to say that's
that's Jesus because that is love or
that's sacrifice oh I can see him in
that story or see him in my situation or
even see him in my darkness which is the
most thing like we all can you know well
I get me the other way around we all we
all like can see God when we're in the
times of darkness right but being in the
light and making sure we honor him and
stuff and but uh again the Bible being
just a very spiritual book and not just
a very spirit the most spiritual book
let me rephrase that that that you can
you can and will ever read because it's
about you we think that it's about King
David we think that it's about these
patriarchs or the Bible but when you
read it God is telling your story
through the through the lives of these
other people and it's it's there's many
different levels and ways and facets we
read it one day and it was about my
again I deal with idolatry right I
remember years ago having certain
idolatry in my life of what I was gonna
do with my life and I had this idea and
God was like speaking to my heart nope
I'm not doing that I got other plans for
you it's like no you opened up doors and
this has happened and now I'm excited
about doing this and and nope I can't in
it so there was something that kind of
said into like between me and God this
inner struggle they know this is what
I'm going to pursue because you told me
in God's like no I didn't so I'm reading
the scriptures and every time I read
about idolatry or the golden calf or the
Israelites complaining or looking to
other gods instead of Yahweh I'm
reminded of like my hidden sin and my
turmoil with the creator of what I was
going
do with my life and and it in this was
years ago and nobody told me how to
interpret it it was just something that
naturally happened through like
fellowship with the Holy Spirit and it's
begin to go through every facet of my
life no matter where I am when I read
the Scriptures God has a Rhema word
which is a now word for me in this
season where I am what's happening my
friends my positioning my business my
family wherever I am I can read the
scriptures and God will communicate his
love to me and through me through his
word it's the most amazing book ever I
know you said that you you didn't have a
Bible with you right now but there was a
scripture that I wanted to to read I was
going to get you to read it but since
you don't have it I'll read it here but
this is a big one for me when it comes
to the occult stuff and just keeping
everything plumb line with Jesus and the
beauty and in his positioning right
knowing who he is versus the other stuff
because it becomes it becomes that about
these other things but it's Acts chapter
19 verse 18 but it says this was about
the Apostle Paul preaching to the Jews
and the Greeks I start with 17 but it
says when this became known to the Jews
in Ephesus they were all seized with
fear and the name of the Lord Jesus was
held in high honor many of those who
believed now came and openly confessed
what they had done and a number who
practiced sorcery brought their scrolls
together and burned them publicly and
when they calculated the value of the
scrolls that came to the fifty thousand
documents in this way the Lord the word
of the Lord spread and grew widely in
power and so then there's other
translations that worded a little bit
differently but it's talking about like
the sorcerers when they heard the gospel
and it pricked their heart like it spoke
to where they were when they heard about
the Lord Jesus and what he did and and
and the message of the Cross and it
pricked them and they took all of their
curious books that they were making of
the books of summoning demons and
summoning dragons and Lucifer and
Levites all kind of weird crazy far-out
stuff out there they could they repent
it
burnt and they were like confess their
sins to have a knowledge it was a trade
off
yeah I'll gladly give this over for
peace I'll gladly trade whatever it is
and in their case it was these scrolls
and these curious arts and sorceries for
us it may be pride it may be hurt it may
be anger bitterness jealousy that we lay
down in order to receive his burden
which is is easy and his yoke is light
and so it's well worth it and if
nobody's ever encountered that love
before man I bid you to come I guarantee
you would be the greatest decision that
you've ever made in your life and we
just try it out just try it out just to
to see how how you've tried everything
else out why not try this and so it's
the most beautiful thing in my life you
know
absolutely and then of that even stands
in the presence of God when you're in
the presence of God all of the yeah you
know philosophies and everything that
you think is I mean if this is a crazy
world we live in
we're in 2020 there's a lot of stuff out
there on the internet there are a lot of
books there list there's just so much
that you can ingest you know we have
audiobooks you can listen to it you know
just the amount of information
consumption is just at an all-time high
so when you confront your creator you
confront God and you you are just
basking in the capital L light all of
the other stuff just goes away you don't
even need it it's like you were saying
you gladly exchange it over because it's
just like okay here yeah you can have
that I wanted to read something yeah
that's good but we get in trouble with
that too you know what I'm saying
because I've seen that to be part of my
pendulum like okay I'm in this this
place where I need God in my life to
move and I just I started getting rid of
everything like I just started throwing
stuff away whether it is I bought a book
or I have a questionable CD there was a
time where we had like like statues of
Jesus and would like a friend of mine
brought a wood carving that he got from
Colombia as a gift for us and we like
you know cross necklaces and anything
that was like a graven image we're like
getting rid
because we just want to be so close to
him and we know we're supported by sin
so we look we're searching our life to
see if it's Christian or not and we're
just knowing everything away so it's
like I think that God reveals himself to
us in those moments like whatever it is
that you're engaging in what maybe maybe
that's right for you at that time you
know I I think that it's it's more
amorphous like it's it's a constant
uncovering you know but I did want to
read something that I found during the
time that God was reconciling me to him
I came across the book of Romans and
it's like I read it for the first time
in a new way you know I'm sure that I
had heard the book of Romans my whole
life but it but it was like Romans
really really shifted things for me and
there was one particular part when I was
going through this transition that
really stuck out to me let's see I'm
gonna start at chapter 1 verse 24 his
invisible attributes namely his eternal
power and divine nature have been
clearly perceived ever since the
creation of the world in the things that
have been made so they are without
excuse for although they knew God they
did not honor him as God or give thanks
to him but they became futile in their
thinking and their foolish hearts were
darkened claiming to be wise they became
fools and exchanged the glory of the
immortal God for images resembling
mortal man and birds and animals and
creeping things because they exchanged
the truth about God for a lie and
worshiped and served the creator or the
creature rather than the Creator who is
blessed forever and this really just
stuck out to me because and this is very
much so related to what you just read
because in those moments it's like you
don't you don't need to lie you don't
need anything but God that's it you
don't need idols you don't need anything
that that makes you feel a certain way I
mean we
you live in this world where there are
so many distractions there are so many
things that we can become obsessed with
and addicted to and we just get wrapped
up in feeling it's all about how we feel
in those moments but it's an emptiness
because it doesn't last forever the love
of God lasts forever it's this eternal
power that is with you forever when you
confront that reality you come in
contact with that truth it shifts your
entire way of being because you know as
you go through your day and you're
engaging in those moments and you're
spending time with people you're working
you're playing you're doing whatever you
have this underpinning this undercurrent
of truth that stays with you and this is
your hope this is your faith this is
this is your true essence of who you are
and that I think is the most important
core and when you come to that it frees
you and then you can you can continue to
deal with like what you and I do where
we're kind of going in we're going back
into you you go through as a as a
warrior and then you come out a warrior
for Christ and you're like okay we've
we've got this underpinning now now
let's go back into the world and let's
let's try to continue to figure these
things out because we live in in the
unknown we're experiencing the unknown
there's always more to learn and grow
through and having that underpinning of
current knowing that I'm covered and
that I'm protected and that I'm loved it
allows me to be that for other people as
well be their protection be their love
and and try to be constant in that love
and unconditional in that constant love
and that right there is is being trying
to align yourself with being the face of
God and and that's that's all of this is
about just trying to align with our
eternal creator yep that's the journey
yeah that scripture reminds me of
Colossians 1 it goes in that's one of my
favorite ones where it goes into like
the depths of this is who Jesus is
versus like he's just another man that
became the Messiah or he was just
another leader you know but it's like
hold on like the the fullness of God was
made manifest through him
I just read some of it right quick -
it's really short it says uh let's see
where we can start Colossians 1 I'm
gonna start with 12 given thanks into
the Father which has made us meet to be
partakers of the inheritance of the
Saints in light who have delivered us
from the power of darkness and hath
translated us into the kingdom of his
dear son in whom we have redemption
through his blood even the forgiveness
of sins who is the image of the
invisible God the firstborn of every
creature for by him we're all things
created that are in heaven and that are
in earth visible and invisible whether
they be Thrones dominions or
principalities or powers all the things
that were created were created by him
and for him and he is before all things
and by him all things consist
and so this gives you this little
glimpse into like the majesty of who he
is there all of the powers the Thrones
the dominions the demons the darkness
the angels all of them must bow to King
Jesus he is the head of them all and so
just trying to get this idea because
it's so confusing
seeking truths or truths right what's
the truth you said this but so-and-so
said that and so people are really
finding placed themselves in this place
where they're just like confused in the
midst of seeking truth in what's his
real name is that Jesus is it Yeshua
well somebody said if I say Yeshua I'm
calling on a demon or like we've all
kind of weird theologies out there but
it's like really seeing Jesus and having
your own encounter with him for who he
truly is and and nobody can take that
away from you I can talk you out of your
theology I can talk you out of your
doctrine but you haven't in an encounter
with the Son of God or with God himself
which is like nobody can take that away
from you you opinions change
philosophies change new information is
provided things change but I think your
encounter with with the Son of God
that's that's that's uh you know nobody
could take that from you and so that's
why I'm big on
encountering Jesus or encountering God
is because like can't take that from you
you know absolutely you read my one of
my favorite verses I love that God has
delivered from the Dominion of darkness
and has transferred us into the kingdom
of his beloved son Jesus in whom we have
redemption through his blood the
forgiveness of sins I mean that that
burst just wow it's just so powerful
was there any mental stuff that you were
going through whether it was a breakdown
I'm obviously it sounds like a breakdown
but was there any like schizophrenia
because we know this how these demons
operate they get in your mind and so the
Bible calls demons as we're let thinking
about dark creatures and entities but
they're strongholds that live in your
mind that when I say the name of Jesus
you get angry that's a spiritual
stronghold you know that it shouldn't
offend you in like there's different
things but did you go through any
schizophrenia with dealing with any of
that stuff or everybody's out to get me
I have to run to Jesus I mean that's my
story and that's why I'm asking
I had interesting I think that for me
the whole time I was going through the
New Age like when people would try to
say that you know people say the
craziest things about Jesus like that
well okay I don't want to say that I
don't I'm trying to be PC here as much
as possible but I heard you know a
person saying like oh Jesus never
existed and like talking about these
things and I the whole time I'm like try
not to laugh cuz I think it's still you
know like it might that was my reaction
so I I never had this like negative
hateful reaction toward Jesus during the
entire time that I was engaged in the
New Age and even in the book I wrote
which was really new agey it's funny
because there's a line in my book that
says Jesus is the way it says that it
was really interesting because when I
was going to edit the book over and over
every time I would pass over that it
didn't fit with the rest of what I had
said but for some reason I couldn't
delete it it was it was like I knew that
it had to stay there and it's so funny
looking back on that now because so it's
like it was the truth that was just
gonna stay in that book
matter what else I did it was just so
it's interesting to look back at that
but to answer your question directly for
me it was like I was being visited in
dreams and she's having like nightmares
and then I was having just really weird
waking sort of I don't even know if
they're hallucinations but you know when
you're dealing with the occult and
you're constantly in that state it's
like you're letting in all kinds of
static and interference and you think
that you're having psychic experiences
but I think that for me it was like I
had crossed over into the supernatural
where I was actually interfacing
physically with my physical eyes with I
don't know demons whatever you want to
call it I don't know but it wasn't
positive I'll tell you right now you
know some people have these types of
negative experiences with things that
they call extraterrestrials or they call
them demons or they call them ant you
know it's just whatever word you want to
put on that because I don't want to you
know again I'm trying to be PC and leave
this open for people's interpretation
but is the night that I realized that I
was under demonic attack I had I was
having this recurring nightmare of being
pulled through my bed down into hell by
demons and there were angels over my
head and their wings were just like flat
like they were flying really really fast
it was like there was a battle going on
for my soul and and demons were trying
to drag me through my bed and I wake up
and and I would just was cold sweat
freaking out like breathing heavy and
then I it was almost like I'd be pulled
back down into the dream and usually
when you wake up and you're breathing
heavy and you're like what is going on
it's hard for you to go back to sleep no
but it was like I was being tugged back
under and with this current and it was
this recurring dream all night and then
I get up and I go into the the bathroom
in the morning and I had bruises on my
back that looked like finger prints and
at that point I was like okay this is
way
a deeper than I initially thought so I
mean that it was all kind of happening
all around the same time but I'm pretty
confident that I was and that's just one
story but yeah it got really scary but
when when I came when I came to God the
the dream stopped the you know all of
that kind of interference going on with
my day during my day all of that just
just gets wiped clear it's gone now I
mean like you deal with other things
like after I you know after that then
you deal with other waves of demonic
attack I think when also like for me
being a public person going through this
very publicly yeah you know Satan
doesn't want to lose same doesn't want
you to come out on the other end and
have things to say against people that
are you know that he really really likes
where they're at in their life so I I
think that there was definitely a layer
of probably not only demonic attack but
there I think there was also witchcraft
involved against me so like a cult
attack yeah yeah yes real man you know
my story very similar you know going
crazy and trying to open up trying to
contact these other entities and doing
rituals that were in like meditations of
how to contact them through guided
meditations and books and I would do so
many of them because like none of them
were working but I knew that was real
because I had encounters so I was like
okay this didn't work let's try this one
and we were just like all of this stuff
and and and where I was that spiritually
it was a bad place to a lot of drinking
and smoking pot every day and stealing
robbing people in gang affiliation a lot
of bad stuff and then mixing occultism
and this trying to contact entities in
the same time so like nothing worked
until they all worked at the same time
like there were just one day - I was
sitting on the couch and I was pulled
into a trance by their will and I
couldn't understand what they were
saying there were colors and shapes and
voices and whispers and I begin to go
mad and I would come back to my body and
I'd be pale shaking crying - trying to
catch my breath because I didn't know
how to breathe they were
come in and pull my consciousness out of
my body and touch realm and it was scary
I didn't know they're speaking like
ancient languages and stuff and I'm
seeing them in the house I'm being
pulled you know we're watching a TV show
or a movie and I'm just pulled in this
freaking trance and my health started to
go downhill sort of coughing up blood
every day and go I'd go out to public
and we try to order something to eat and
I couldn't look people in the face
because I heard like when it was
probably really heightened senses of the
psychic ability stuff or where but like
demons were messing with it to where
like I knew what the people were
thinking everybody was looking at me and
it was just system and I was a teenager
I don't think I was 15 when this was
half and you know I was gonna I was
gonna mad but before that I knew about
Jesus I had been a Christian a couple
years before that but fell away to get
gotten deeper into the occult and the
scripture says that once you have once
you you're you're dealing with demons
and you get free of those demons of
those spirits when they leave Jesus says
when they leave a person they go out to
dry places and they seek seven other
spirits stronger than themselves and say
hey I got cast it out but I want to go
back will y'all help me get back into
the house that I once dwelt in which is
your body and so they say ok so I get
seven stronger spirits than themselves
and they come back to that vessel and if
you have if then when them demons leave
you have to do the inner work and clean
out your mind sweep the house and if the
demon comes in the house is swept clean
his bed is not there anymore then they
can't get in but the Holy Spirit exactly
fill it with the Holy Spirit you're
right if you don't need the scripture
says that the state of that person is
worse off than before and so that's what
happens and so that's what happened to
me I was just dabbling with the occult
as a kid Wow got born again radically
saved and but then turn my back to it to
you know get into witchcraft and
occultism and and we like I've
interacted with beings
other realms like that have crossed over
you know what I'm saying and like they
physically showed up and so that like
lit this weird fire within me to like
continue to pursue the occult because
there was some type of power there you
know that that I can summon entities or
in it to show up on command and do
things for me but there wasn't what they
said that they were you know and they
always demand something when you try to
make pacts with those entities they
demand something you know they want
something from you or whether it's you
wearing a trinket or
an idol in your home or whatever the
case is that you have a alter a lot of
these entities want most of them want to
take up residency in your mind and they
want to live in your mind just let me
just let me live in your mind you know
and you become you know what the Bible
calls demonized or possessed with
unclean spirits and you have these
strongholds in your life and don't even
know it
yeah wow that is an incredible story
yeah and that's the thing a lot of a lot
of people who don't have the experiences
that you've had or that I've had or that
other people have had they don't
personally think it's dangerous because
they think this is what they'll say this
is what I've heard people say to me oh
well you just didn't do your your
clearings and you didn't put the the
white bubble of light around you and and
you you know and and what my response to
that is oh I was doing all of those
things all those things you read on the
internet I was doing those things too
but what you realize is that there are
pattern I'll be a broken record there
are powers out there that are more
powerful than you that's just the
reality they need a host they're not
more powerful than God they're not more
powerful than Christ that's why it's so
funny that's what the lady told me so we
you know we stole a bunch of witchcraft
books so we never bought books we had
about 40 or 50 books at a whole library
but we'd still them we'd wear eye
jingoes or whatever it is nineties and
we'd steal witchcraft books and
obviously that was some of the energy I
was dealing with too still in it so we
took all the books we stole it and we
brought them to the witchcraft store
born again and we wanted to see if we
can get some money for it if we could
sell it back to them because we wanted
to buy Bibles so we took the books and
we still hate and they gave us like $20
for like 50 books yourself it was enough
to buy two Bibles and I think a
Christian worship CD and a VOD CD I knew
that p OD was a Christian band and but
the lady told us we told us like she's
like why are you getting rid of these
books it was like because I had an
encounter with Jesus and I was like
telling her what happened and and my
story and she said what your person
would say oh you didn't do the inner
work you didn't do that you have to
shield yourself you didn't shield yeah
you got psychic okay whatever whatever
you can have the shielding like I need
Jesus like trying to coach me on how to
do it I'm like it's crazy well and again
not to out anybody maybe maybe we should
kill the magic though when it comes to
idolizing people putting them on the
pedestals and stuff you've seen I've
seen a lot of stuff about like some
people that I've looked up to in these
movements dr. Steven Greer which got me
into a lot of that stuff for contacting
entities and aliens and stuff and ce-5
initiative which I still like some of it
but we've heard stories about like he's
a different person off-camera and I know
there's many people in the Christian
community who are loving light but
off-camera there's some of the meanest
most bitter people you ever meet but
when the cameras on high everyone prays
what is that is did you experience
anything like that as far as like
inappropriate stuff or sleeping around
or any it was you you know any dark
stuff that you encountered that the
people we're doing or was it just your
own inner journey or was there really
like dark stuff going on that you that
that they were involved in I'm not gonna
throw shade at anyone um I also don't
really engage in that kind of slinging
online because I think that we all have
weaknesses and we
have you know parts of our personality
that I don't know I don't I don't I
don't really want to touch any of that
but I did meet dr. Steven Greer a couple
times I used to live in Virginia and I'd
see him at the coffee shop he seemed
more like like a really nice guy I met
him and his team and I just off the top
of my head he seemed like a nice guy but
but I think to speak to the greater
issue here because I think that there's
a instead of getting down in the muck
and kind of like slinging shade I think
we can have sort of a larger more
appropriate or mature conversation and
just say that when it comes to receiving
information and engaging in pursuit of
information there are a lot of
distractions out there and there are
lots of addictive threads of research
that can get you spinning and wheels not
really taking you anywhere and so what I
will ask I will ask a question you know
when you're going to research something
ask yourself like where is this gonna
lead me what is the overall message here
what is it that I'm really sinking
seeking so there are you know you
mentioned ce-5 and there was a question
in the comments earlier that this is a
perfect time to get to it but just ask
the question was about people that are
trying to seek out and call out to UFOs
or ETS or whatever and and what my my
perspective is on that now she's got a
really loud ring imager okay so in my
experience with this concept of c-5 and
for those of you who don't know
basically going outside with a group of
people and trying to call down UFOs or a
te tease is that how you would define it
yeah about that okay a lot of these
circumstances that I would see people do
this in they were actually engaging in
occult practices before so I'm wondering
like what is and this is I'm just saying
a question I'm not making any judgments
my question is what is the relation
between going out with a group of people
and calling out
UFOs or ETS and occult practices like
channeling and you know table tipping or
you know a lot of these people will go
into meditative States and then call out
to whatever entities are around and pull
them down now you got to kind of ask
yourself like when you're just calling
to anything in the your broadcasting
with a group of people and calling down
anything that will respond you know some
people will disagree with me because
they don't believe in evil but I do
think that there we should have a little
bit of discernment when we go out with
groups of people and just call out to
the universe hey if you're around I want
to see something because you want to see
something the whole idea here is that
you want to be entertained you want to
see something with your eyes that is
going to allow you to go huh see there's
something unexplained here and then you
see it's called a sign in a wonder and
then it hooks you and you want more and
now you're going like what does all of
this mean and then you get trapped in
this thread of a research of information
processing about something that you just
said the demons want to take up place in
your mind right that's what brought came
to mind when you said that it's like
they want to take your time they want to
take you they want to harvest your
consciousness they want to waste your
time they want to take you away from
anything that is actually going to be
beneficial for you or healing so you can
get looped up in these this constant
state of processing and feeding upon
information meanwhile you're actually
being spiritually harvested and you're
not going anywhere fast um I talked
about ce-5 a lot and my music and I've
got a whole verses dedicated to it you
ain't living you ain't never been alive
till you're sitting in the field and try
to seee five hands up as close to the
night sky
don't doubt just believe see and fly by
initiate contact of the fifth kind Light
Beings 5d and beyond they've been
watching over you the whole time seeing
synchronicities follow the signs
don't doubt just trust and you will see
aliens angels Elohim ETS in the Bible
wrote in Chariots of Fire angelic
benevolent Enoch and Elijah didn't taste
death death because they were
swept away in a flame by night and a
cloud by day what's next is
communication and - it's a telepathy and
raise vibrations and so I've got I've
got a lot of stuff
the ce-5 movement and if you listen in
there you heard me talk about the
angelic so my introduction to ce-5
wasn't even through dr. Greer or any of
the new ways guys it was - and a guy
named Patrick Cooke who had I was having
dreams about aliens and things like that
and I was just trying to find out if
there's anything in the Bible and stuff
and I found this website back in the day
which was amazing Bible UFO dot-com by
Patrick cook and for me being in the
church is starting to research aliens
and all of these things I found that
website and it was I mean just tons and
tons and tons of scripture references
and historical references from the 1300s
and all of these like so-called UFO
encounters but he was a Christian but he
was the first one that kind of talked
about the alien thing in a angelic way
versus a demonic way most of the
Christian people are gonna tell you that
aliens or demons stay away kind of thing
right so he was the first one I had a
website and he would do interviews he's
been on coast to coast he's not with us
anymore but my book has a quote from him
at the beginning I quoted him but it
really lit a fire within me so it was
that website and then a video I seen of
a guy named prophet Yahweh I don't know
if you've ever seen this video but then
this was back man this was like 2010
2009 2010 watch this video it's just old
black guy just in all white and the news
covers him so the new that news crew
comes out is like there's a man here
claims that he can summon UFOs with the
by using the Hebrew version of the Bible
and I watched this video clip and then
he comes out there and they're in this
open field and the news crews there and
he's like yes I can summon you know the
the the the angels of the most high will
show up on the show up on cue for me and
and he pretty he gets on his knees and
he prays and he holds his hand up in the
air and he says Yahweh so that these
people would think that I'm not crazy
will you send your angelic messengers
and let them see
you are who you say you are and you are
watching over us and sure enough there
was this little you know light during
the day it was like this orb that was
way out there that appeared and
everybody at the news station was like
oh wow it happened and they called the
airport to see if there was anything
flying by and he blimps anything and it
wasn't so the Prophet Yahweh thing like
did something to me oh wow and then I
found out Steven Greer and that kind of
thing so a lot of my encounters went
from seeing that and going from a
biblical response of in prayer time okay
God let me see your messengers let me
see the Elohim in the Bible it talks
about the Seraphim these are beings that
are made out of light the fire of God
and when they travel back and forth
there they look like fire if they're out
there and I mean just stargazing an odd
wonder of God and who he is and just
looking up and saying okay God if
they're out there let me see and I'm
kind of begging but it was going through
God my father who loves me you know
who's not gonna send me if I ask for as
fish he's not gonna send me a serpent if
I ask for bread he's not gonna give me a
stone so my father if if your messengers
are out there if they are traveling back
and forth from heaven to earth as Enoch
says as it talks about in the Book of
Daniel in some of these other scriptures
that says his ministers or a flame of
fire let me see them and and finally the
stinging out there long enough by myself
I started having these encounters that
were very similar to the ce-5 initiative
stuff where God would just allow me to
see these crazy things in the night sky
of them flying out of stars and into
stars and showing up and fleets of what
we would call UFOs or angels in the sky
so for me it's always been an angelic
thing but the only person in the there
is no context in the Christian community
of what what I was seeing you know so I
kind of got into the ce-5 and these are
the Pelagians or the Andromeda or
whatever versus just the angels or
messengers or Seraphim or whatever so
like if I was having encounters that
were blowing my mind
but were really drawing me closer to the
Father it made it more real
for me that like heaven was a place out
there versus this imaginary land that we
go when we die we're just translated but
night no heaven exist past what we call
outer space is to heaven where the most
high is that and the angels travel back
and forth from heaven earth and I'm
reading this stuff in the scriptures
so that was my encounters but I was
having so many that would just blow in
my mind and you know it was a beautiful
experience for me that's cool the other
day I guess was the first of January of
this year I hadn't had a lucid dream in
a really long time I usually have really
really lucid dreams all the time and I
hadn't had one in like a year and on the
first of the year I was laying in bed
and I was like man I just want to make
sure I'm on the right path God like
you're a sovereign God and I just want
to do I just want your will for my life
and I'm like writing this book and I was
like sorry I was starting to sort of
relaunch my channel and I said you know
it'd be really cool if you just send me
a sign in a dream your sovereign you
don't have to but if you did it would be
so cool to like have a sign and just
know I'm on the right path and that
night and an angel or this light being
this white being just appeared in the
middle of my dream and I went completely
lucid and I'm standing there and I'm
like oh my gosh I asked for a sign from
God and there's just being stood in
front of me it was really cool and it's
a agile and it just disappeared Wow yeah
and then the next day I was like
thinking about like what does that mean
and then that night I thought well I
wonder if there's anything about agility
in the Bible and so I looked up agility
and it occurs in three places but the
the verse is basically about God making
the feet like the feet of a deer and I
looked at I'm like what does that mean
as basically like God has you covered
like you don't have to know all of the
ways that you're walking because he's
gonna like make sure to put your feet on
the high places you know it's like a
really cool message and I'm like man and
just that alone that revelation like and
you know maybe maybe it wasn't a sign
from God maybe it was just a dream maybe
I just put things together that didn't
mean anything or whatever you want to
say which fine I'll accept that but at
that moment it was like everything
changed and I was like I had that
confidence that that confidence in me
and I'm like I think I can do this
because
covered by God I don't have to be so
worried about you know what's gonna
happen and how people are gonna perceive
it I'm just gonna move forward I know
that God has my blind spots covered and
at that moment that's when I was able to
like have the confidence to relaunch the
channel and everything so it's kind of
interesting like you're talking about
these experiences that you've had that
made you feel closer to God and that's
the same thing that happened for me
recently where it's like you you you get
some kind of sign and it makes you feel
closer to God like that's that's great
that's cool you know yeah it's so
awesome man it's like again taking back
our power like the New Age gets to have
all the fun no no they don't you know
what I'm saying I'm with you no did I
think they the one who thought they
stole from us man you know what I'm
saying of all of it the Stars and it's
you know astrology or you know Astro
theology that stuff is taken from us
like yeah I believe in Astro theology
and Santos Bonacci and Jordan Maxwell
cuz it you don't hear many Christians
talking about it they're starting to now
though praise God and they're doing it
from a biblical perspective but the
Bible talks about the mazzaroth and the
zodiac and Orion and the Pleiades and
all of the stuff is mentioned of in the
scriptures for like it's almost like
God's calendar that's telling the story
as we make our way through through the
zodiac every year and just to say that
we can't look into any of it or whatever
the case is it's so ludicrous especially
when the Bible is full of it and it's so
beautiful again you don't have to
abandon your faith to like look into any
of these spiritual abilities because
they're all throughout the Bible they're
your god-given birth rights you can hear
what people are thinking it's called
discernment of spirits it's called it's
called different things but learning how
to focus it and and harness it and use
it for the good of mankind and give
honor and glory back to the one who is
communicating to you through it in the
first place you know what I'm saying of
using our senses and all that stuff it's
beautiful man there's nothing that tops
it and so I get convicted and get into
idolatry when I try to go outside of I
started looking up these researchers who
were talking about it more because there
was no Christian stuff but again now
there's a lot though I'm really awesome
everybody listened to me look up
somebody named Chris Carter
I interviewed him on the podcast again I
mentioned Gil Hodges in the next the
next stages or Kingdom talks and they
have a podcast like this with Christians
and and they don't interview any new
agers it's all Christians and it's all
supernatural otherworldly like amazing
encounters of angels and God expressing
his love to them through Christ through
other means but it's all Christian so
there is no like you know weird occultic
practices going on they do it in the
confines of a biblical worldview which
is what I try to do so there's a lot
more people who are having this
conversation and it's it's awesome and
I'm glad that now I'm able like
Christians or one wanting to talk to me
now just like back in the day I had to
go talk to the New Ager so I had to be
there now I choose to be there as well
but I love getting with my peeps you
know and talking about Jesus and how
beautiful I started talking to new
agents about how beautiful Jesus is and
they're like the hell are you talking
about they don't know
so I there's a hope that that they'll
pick up something or listen to the
conversation or you know and they do you
know what I'm saying reflecting the love
of Christ and they find their first love
or meet them for the first time and it's
worth it all the New Age mumbo jumbo and
conversations about reincarnation they
all become worth it when that one person
responds to the message of God's love
and it comes into that relationship with
Christ it's worth it to me well thank
you for your work I really appreciate it
and thanks for having me on your show
this has been really fun no it's been
awesome thank you for hanging out with
me and blessing me with your first
interview on this side of 2020 and this
side of awakening and and moving forward
and and I'm on your team and anything
you need I'm here for you you want to
work together on some videos collaborate
I'm super down just let me know and I'll
show you really good singer - heck yeah
for sure yeah definitely it'd be awesome
I'm gonna get you in touch with my
people that Kingdom talks to try to set
you up an interview over there you'll
fall in love with you be all scream and
look forward to it
well thank you and
everybody for watching - I really
appreciate you sharing me with your
community this has been a lot of fun
lots of fun in the chat - oh yeah so for
people who don't know where to find you
work where's the best place that they
can go to check out your content you can
go to the divine frequency com that's my
website that's kind of the central hub
for everything you can find all my
social media on there but I'm also on
Twitter and YouTube my YouTube channels
to find frequency and twitter is divine
frequency as well so just hit me up and
my name is Teresa generis thank you my
friend really enjoyed it have a good one
YouTube Teresa you nervous
I said you narrows for some reason but
uh that's her name she's awesome and I
love where she's at man and what God is
doing in her life and just a testimony
of you know what can happen when you
when you put your faith in God and no
matter where you are man the love of God
reaches there's no way there's nowhere
that you can go that you can like outrun
God's grace if you if you choose to make
your your bed in hell he's there with
you
wherever you choose to go I mean it's
it's communicated to us to us through
the biblical stories man no matter what
you do his love is always there he would
never leave you and never forsake you
so I want to say a quick prayer man if
you guys have never encountered the Holy
Spirit if you've never encountered God's
love I want to say a prayer for you that
you will be able to feel his tangible
presence the presence of the Holy Spirit
which he's madly in love with you and
he's been pursuing you and you've been
hanging out on this podcast for over two
hours for a reason and the reason is
this so that you can encounter the love
of God father I just thank you for my
friends lord I thank you that they're
listening to this God there even as
we're mentioning things God they're
examining their own life as we're
talking about this self-examination as
we're talking about love as we're
talking about grounding in Christ and
sometimes we get so far out there and so
Spacey or so spiritually minded that
were no earthly good or we begin to be
whether it's be ashamed of Jesus and
because his name is an offense to many
and it's a stumbling block to many so we
just get kind of scared to even say that
name because it doesn't look deeper
it's not respected father I just pray
Lord that you bring that person home
let them me encounter your love right
now in a tangible way your peace you
love your ecstasy God that there's none
like you and all the earth father God we
try to put things in place of you and
just as Teresa said it's idolatry
these substitutes God that never do a
good job I just pray right now father
guy that you just encountered them with
your love right now peace of God just to
rest upon them Holy Spirit just to move
the baptism of your fire and your grace
Lord simply contingent upon your love
that you call us embed us to cast our
cares upon you could you care for us
so right now whoever's listening I just
want you to do this cast your cares upon
him the thing that you've been worrying
about whatever it is whether it's
eternity whether it's your career
whether it's finances whether it's a
loved one whether it's your health
whatever it is that seems to be getting
in the way that seems to be taking up
the focus I want you to cast it right
before his feet just give it to him
think of it see it and to say father I
give it to you I give that thing to you
father that you would receive it father
consumed it with your fire
give them a peace that surpasses all
understanding right now peace peace
peace no more doubt no more fear no more
worry in Jesus mighty name thank you
lord amen and amen it's as easy as that
man if you've never made him the lord of
your life and you want to come into a
relationship with this with this person
we've been talking about you want to
know you the Creator through the person
of Jesus man because he is the way he's
provided the way just do that just say
Jesus asked you to come into my life
cleanse me of my sins make me right
before God I acknowledge the work that
you did on the cross defeating sin
if forgiven my sins by the blood that
you shed
father make your home in my heart
it's that simple if you've said that
prayer and you meant it send me an email
send me a message God has amazing things
in store for you change your life the
best decision and you can ever make just
coming home no matter where you are no
matter how far off you you are or no
matter how far off you were you never
thought you're never so far that the
love of God is is is away from you it's
always there just focus on it Jesus
mighty name father thank you thanks for
hanging out with me guys really enjoyed
this episode if you want to check out
more of what we have going on want to be
a part of our Thursday night school of
the Mystics encounter sessions to really
tap in and encounter the love of God in
a deeper way with a community an online
group of people make sure that you reach
out to us you can go to my patreon
patreon comm backslash truth seeker or
just go to truth seeker comm a bunch of
really cool stuff that you get access to
my encountering Jesus meditations are
available there
throne room and meditation radically
changing people's life with the love of
God and they don't even know it it's
amazing make sure you check that stuff
out with that being said I'm gonna say
peace and Shalom we're gonna do this
again very soon love you guys peace
peace
that does it for this episode folks here
more episodes of the truth seeker
podcast head over to Jessica calm and if
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