Spirituality and Conscious Recovery | TJ Woodward | TruthSeekah Podcast

Spirituality and Conscious Recovery | TJ Woodward
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CabsGeGGjQ
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without further ado we're gonna go ahead
and jump into today's discussion my
friend is joining me today tj
woodward tj what's up brother welcome to
the podcast
thank you so much i'm so delighted to be
here and like you
spirituality and recovery are my two
favorite topics to discuss so i'm
grateful to be here
uh awesome man so uh i've got a little
bit of uh
um um what do you what would you say i
got a little bit of uh experience
dealing with recovery and the spiritual
part uh
especially coming from the uh the uh aa
side
now are you connected to those uh realms
at all
the aaa healing and stuff
yeah i mean that's you know early in my
own recovery i got sober in 1986 12-step
program
saved my life and i was you know that
was a big part of my early path
honestly for well over a decade or two
honestly that that was a big part of
my early recovery and it i would say it
laid the groundwork for me in such a
powerful way
so many amazing loving people there that
really wanted to lend a hand and share
their experience how they
actually walked through and broke their
own cycle of addiction
that's awesome um recently i've got a
friend of mine who
finally started working the program
right kind of been in and out of little
recovery programs and stuff and it
didn't really work i guess he didn't
really want it bad enough
but when he decided to work the programs
like we found out that it works
right and that's with any of the
modalities in any of the different
recovery programs or discipleship
discipline those kind of things they
work and so
it was interesting because they invited
me to do some guided meditations for the
people
to actually go in and find inner healing
through a guided meditation so i went
with a lot of these people who are
recovering addicts and stuff and i was
able to lead them so it was
real beautiful so just to see how like
even
they're incorporating the spirituality
into it like the spiritual side of
recovery and
um going through those 12 steps and
stuff and you see
recently i was listening to a podcast
with um
mike tyson and one of the guys uh
one of his mentors was talking about how
the 12-step programs
mimic like these uh psilocybin journeys
that a person goes through with this
inward
reflection and i need to go make amends
and i need to ask for forgiveness and i
need to right my wrongs and
takes you through these this process of
even like
coming to grips with like what what
plant medicines are doing for people as
well
so there's like all of these different
modalities and and
realms that are echoing this healing in
these kind of
steps that are throughout all types of
religion right it's in the bible it's in
plant medicine it's in a a it's in
spirituality so
just to see how we are like everyone is
uh really big into the
inner healing now and going through
these these types of spiritual processes
yeah absolutely i mean that's what what
you're speaking to is so powerful
because
there are so many different paths
available to people now
and yet at the core of them the
essential
truths if you will are really very very
similar right
and for me spirituality is about a
journey inward it's about returning to
that place of inner perfection
uh we come into this world wide open
perfectly connected with the truth of
who we are our own beingness
and then we come to planet earth for
whatever reason whether we signed up for
it
it's random you know we could debate
that and talk about that for hours but
for whatever reason we came here
and we end up getting programmed to
believe that we're not a whole imperfect
spiritual being
and so you know i think the connection
with addiction is pretty
obvious that existential separation
from our true nature is a very painful
way to live and then people seek relief
from that
and so then recovery in whatever form
you take whether that's 12th step there
are a lot of different paths now
i created conscious recovery a few years
ago as another
path toward returning to that essential
nature
so for me recovery is more about
unlearning and
moving through all those layers of
illusion so that we can get back to our
true nature
and for you with the uh conscious
recovery was that just something that
was
revealed to you is it because obviously
it's like
like if it's truth it's gonna be you
know i'm saying mimicked by a lot of
different modalities and other people
are going to say it
versus just like i created it this is
what it is right everything is speaking
this healing again talking about the
plant medicines or even different sects
and forms of religion give you very
various ways of forgiveness and inner
child healing and
things like that if you take those steps
and so for you how did you how did you
come up with
the different modalities that were
working for you that you can actually
take people through this stuff as well
with conscious recovery
well it started first with my own
personal experience you know when i
got into recovery it wasn't
an instant relief for me when i put down
the drugs and alcohol because what i
quickly realized was
that was managing something and what it
was managing is something you already
mentioned and that was a lot of trauma
in my past
that i hadn't yet healed and also that
disconnection
and then a sense of shame i really
believed i was broken
and i met a remarkable woman when i was
about a year sober roughly and named
mary helen brownell
who really changed my life she was a
devotee of sai baba's she was
a student of eastern thought and she
brought in a really different approach
and that approach is
what if we are this whole imperfect
spiritual being
and that addiction was really us trying
to return to a sense of wholeness
right it was like an outward search for
that feeling of
interconnection so i started working
with her
and had some really profound experiences
that really
laid the groundwork for a kind of a
different approach
because i think a lot of times people
that have an addiction
are labeled as an addict or labeled as
broken in some way
and i've been working in the addiction
treatment field for 12 years and so
through my own experience of
this new approach approach it's a little
bit different
and through looking at most of the
modalities and treatment we're only
looking at the symptoms and behaviors
without actually healing some of the
trauma and the disconnection and the
shame
that's how i created conscious recovery
it was really out of my own experience
first in my own recovery
and then with many years of working with
clients
that's awesome um so when it comes to
like doing that inner work it's like i
guess
you know a lot of the different
modalities deal with i get i guess at
least the popular ones they deal with
the symptoms right versus going down to
the roots almost like modern medicine
where you know we could treat the
symptoms and if that's the case we
we kind of have you as like a it's like
an mlm in a sense because we're going to
continue to treat your symptoms versus
going down to the root
and like fixing you and stuff so that's
the the interesting thing with it
um is is that you have to go to the root
of the trauma
of of the addiction right because the
the addiction's just
a symptom of you calling out for more of
you feeling
unworthy of you even wanting to feel
anything like i just want to feel in
these drugs like
gives me an instant feeling in instant
gratification
there's so so many different ways but
going to to the root of that
um and i guess one of the you know i'm
saying most interesting
parts of what you're talking about with
this healing is the understanding that
there is a aspect of you or at least
you in general that is perfect right
is is already healed is uh that knows
everything
um we hear different stuff like you know
connecting with the higher self
like there's a version of you like in
space or in heaven or whatever that that
is perfected
maybe you can communicate with that
aspect of you which is the true you
that's kind of like your avatar watching
what's going on here
but drawing that power from
a place of you or a god by a higher
power with dealing with
a a or christianity or any of these
other uh
modalities the fact that there's an
aspect of you that that's already healed
and that you need to to connect with
that
part of yourself what what what is that
process
like for for for you to do it and
leading people through that process
well you're speaking to the root of it
right because as you said in western
met in the western medical model we
treat symptoms and behaviors
and that has been true with behavioral
health or with um addiction treatment
and i love that you're using the word
healing because i really want us to
shift the conversation from addiction
treatment to addiction healing and as
you have said it starts with a
recognition that there is a place within
me
that is whole and perfect that's
unharmed and unharmable
and i think a lot of counselors
therapists and clinicians very well
meaning
have been trained to diagnose and treat
but unfortunately
most of them have been trained to
only look at the symptoms as you said
right so if we continue to focus
only on the symptoms someone might go to
treatment they go to treatment for 30
days they have a physical detox
there's a stabilization that happens and
they feel better and then they go out
into the world with this recovery plan
but most of these recovery plans are
still focused on the symptoms and
behaviors right so as i'm going to avoid
this
i'm going to do this in terms of
communicating with my partner i'm going
to
address these issues at work but what
we're talking about
is a much deeper healing and that is how
do i actually return
to that recognition of my true nature
and the process as you're asking the
question what's the process so for me
it's
it's twofold um to say it really simply
it's
reconnecting with that essential nature
and that comes through prayer and
meditation mindfulness that can come
through chanting that can come through
yoga
a spiritual practice of remembering that
truth and
practicing that connection connection is
not really the word because it's really
who and what we are so it's remembering
that
but then it's also looking at all the
layers of trauma
shame and disconnection that are on top
of that essential truth
so it's also what do we need to address
and unlearn
but not just through the symptoms but
really getting down to
when did i originally separate from my
true nature
what were those conditions how do i
start taking care of and you mentioned
that inner child
work that young that my young self that
made these huge decisions with very
limited information
and so getting back to that true nature
while also spending time on what needs
to be unlearned discovered and
lived beyond are really the sort of the
two pathways to
conscious recovery um one of the one of
the
uh uh things that
from a christian perspective we had a
problem with like um
uh a.a was dealing with the fact that
you know these people identified
themselves that they would always be
addicted that they would always be an
addict that they would always be a drunk
right
now from from your perspective is that
something that stands out to you because
like we
we want you to be healed we want you to
be delivered set freed and you never
struggle with that again right
versus this idea is that if i have one
sip i'm going back into it head first
you know that kind of thing
and it was just always just like this
you never got free of it like it was a
monster always lurking
maybe that's truth right but i know
that's something that we hadn't
we always had like a problem with with a
a because you were always addicted and i
used to hate
talking to these individuals and i'm
like man you could be set free man you
could [Â __Â ] you can find healing you can
find peace and you ain't got to worry
about that and no i'll always be an
addict
i'll always be this and so i think that
notion
scares them away from alcohol or drugs
or whatever the case is the fact that it
is a monster that
wants to come come and get them it's a
side of them that they hate that is
still real
and and maybe there's a lot of truth to
that but for for you and what you do
bring to the table
what do you see about that i'm always an
addict or i'm always in recovery
kind of thing well i think there are a
couple of different ways i can answer
it one is that could be a truth
in relative reality but not the ultimate
truth right the ultimate truth is
there is a place within me that's
unharmable and so the question i ask is
what
does it create when and that question is
really powerful
for me so what does it create when i
believe that i have a lifelong chronic
illness that i can never
heal i can only treat what does it
create when i believe
that i'm fundamentally broken in some
way which is what a lot of times people
get told
you're fundamentally different than
other people you're going to have this
for the rest of your life
it's not something you can ever heal but
just something you can treat on a daily
basis
here's the trick though a lot of times
the ego which can be a trickster
might hear me saying well then if i can
heal
from addiction then i can drink normally
that's not really what i'm
saying what i'm saying is and what
you're saying here is that
the addiction is the symptom it's not
the issue right it's something that i
have but not who i
am and if i continue to affirm that i
am this broken person and if that's a
lifelong
inner dialogue and that frequency that
i'm holding by believing in my own
brokenness
i think it creates a lot of limitation
we could take this deeper and talk about
the literal disease it creates in the
body
but the question that i ask myself and i
invite others to ask
isn't is this good or bad or right or
wrong
it is what gets created when i so what
gets created when i believe that i am
broken in some way
or that i have this lifelong chronic
illness versus what gets created
when i believe that the addiction or the
substance use
was a symptom of something and i can
become
curious about that part of me that is
still whole what gets created in those
two different scenarios and then that's
an individual choice for the person
that's in recovery how they want to
frame that in their own life
so with that being said um for you
personally what was your addiction was
it alcohol was it drugs
it was um for me it was alcohol and from
age like 13. i got sober
young i got sober just before i turned
21 so 34 years ago
um it was also ecstasy and and you know
what i know about that i know there's a
lot of different names now whether we
call that molly or mdma
but that that particular drug what
happened for me is the moment that
i took that drug the first time it did
break down all those barriers right it
did remove all those layers of trauma
now it was done
chemically so it wasn't necessarily a
deep and authentic experience but it was
one of the first moments
when i actually remembered my true
nature so that's why i
i frame that sometimes addiction itself
can be a search for wholeness because
when i took that the first time
i remembered my true nature now for me
someone might be able to do that and
have that experience and then a year
later come back to that and have that
experience again for me it was like oh
the next night i wanted more
yeah and so i did that for a year and it
became a really really dark period of my
life because i was
so i felt so broken inside and i was
searching for someone or something to
try to heal that
so yeah those were the two substances
that that i was using
now yeah there's so much to say about
that i've i've got friends who
have similar stories i got i got one
friend he was uh he was
over he was right under 400 pounds and
um
you know never was a ladies a man or
nothing like that and so
his uh his his brother was was uh he had
connections in atlanta
and uh had him out there at a party and
went to a party and gave him
ecstasy and there's all of these
beautiful women like hanging on him
kissing him and
this is the first time you know and like
treating you know they don't see his
you know weight or whatever and so that
was addictive like hey
this is the key and it got to you know
like you every night every weekend we
need this
if without it we're broken but what that
does to your emotions man and you know
i'm saying your serotonin
and your dopamine like this instant
gratification
we've learned the hard way that instant
gratifications are never good
with anything i think the key to life is
is uh
dealing with um delayed gratifications
like putting in work
working hard for friendships for love
you know what i'm saying for a job a
career like it's delayed gratification
you work hard today
you got to plant you got to put
something in the ground tomorrow when it
when it when it blossoms and and you
reap the harvest then you can
uh rejoice but there is work and stuff
that go into it so dealing with a lot of
the
instant gratifications again alcohol i
mean every drug you know you're chasing
that dragon
trying to go back to that first
experience with that being said going
back to the alcohol for you
is it something now because this is the
difference between
like a a and stuff like that is it
something where you can enjoy
a drink now can you have a glass of wine
or is it
lurking there ready to to you know i'm
saying devour you
um or is it something you've come to
terms with and now you can you can deal
with it responsibly
as far as alcohol is concerned
well so for me it's actually something
different
because people often ask me that
question right so
you were young how do you even know like
if you don't have this
lifelong label of being an addict or an
alcoholic which i don't
then can i drink normally but for me
this is what i want to say
my life in recovery is so rich and so
full
that i don't have any desire to drink so
i for myself i've
chose i am choosing abstinence i have
chosen abstinence it's what works for me
i remember my friend doug when i i met
him he got
clean and sober as they call it um at 14
and when i met him he was um in his late
20s so it was like
13 14 years and he said i don't even
know
if i actually have what people label as
an addiction
or i'm not going to label myself as an
addict or an alcoholic but what i know
is my life today is so beautiful and so
open
and so rich everything i was seeking in
that drug or in the alcohol
i actually have created in my spiritual
journey
so i personally would not want to one
you know you could say i wouldn't want
to take that risk but i don't
feel like it's looming i feel like it's
a moment-to-moment choice that i don't
really
necessarily even desire that path now
because
i love my life sober and the truth is we
don't change
habits based on what we don't want we
change habits based on what we do
want so if i focus on what i want in my
life that just doesn't even include the
entertaining of the idea of
having a drink that would would help me
relax right because it's not going to
help me relax in the same way as a
meditation practice
or my spiritual journey now as far as
that's concerned with different you know
outside stimulants and things like that
something
outside of ourselves that's the biggest
thing is we need something outside of
ourselves to be fulfilled
and i think that that's what spiritual
true spirituality teaches you and
even the bible that the kingdom of
heaven is within you and we don't go
without we go within
to go without kind of thing right um so
what about like plant medicines
whether it's psilocybin or any type of
other stimulants like we just
had we just did a personal cacao
ceremony me and my wife
really beautiful heart opening um you
know
legal natural those kind of things what
about your
relationship with plant medicines or
even the idea of those things
so the idea of those things is i'm very
open to that because i've heard people
having
really profound experiences it's not
something that i've chosen to do
and i don't know if that you know just
transparently i don't know if that's an
old program from my early recovery it's
like
you know that strict guidance but for me
it hasn't been part of my path
i have seen it really work miracles in
people's lives
so you know i personally am open to that
idea
um but for my own journey i choose not
to do it and that's just where i'm
landing just today
yeah yeah understood understood um
connecting with that uh that that true
you that that
um authentic self what what are some of
the different ways again to to connect
with the perfect itself
and and what does it do when we connect
or we see
like are we connecting with something
outside of us or is it us again like we
like to talk about the higher self
it's perfected god is perfected there's
a future version of you somewhere else
that's perfected
versus like i am already this what is
the
like you know engaging with that look
like for you like in a meditation or
even just being mindful that i am
beautiful i am loved i am whole those
kind of things
well i think there's a paradox right
because i think it's both inside
and outside i think there is an outer
search for
the idea or the concept or the
experience of some kind of higher power
and ultimately it's within right it's
within each and every one of us
and that the reality i think the greater
reality is there actually
isn't a separation in the way we might
believe it is
right because many of us have been
trained to believe that we're separate
from
god or separate from source but the
truth is we're all a spark of that
divinity right and as you
said you know jesus came in many great
teachers but jesus was one that said the
kingdom of heaven is within so what does
that actually mean
that means that the consciousness of the
concept or the idea of heaven
whatever that means to us lives within
me
and so there the paradox comes in this
it's it's the journey is inward and yet
we want to connect with people
and we want to connect with the world so
it's both and not either
or but ultimately i think the journey is
about
returning to that remembrance of the way
we came into the world which is
deeply connected with our true nature
um with so with that being said there's
this idea
i keep going back to the christian thing
that's just my upbringing in a lot of
realms that i'm in
there's the idea of um original sin
right that you are dirty that you are
broken kind of thing and
but then on the other hand there's like
this you know the aspect of
um you know original perfection as well
there's a lot of christians even talking
about that now that that we we were
perfected before we fell or whatever the
case says and that's our original state
is a state of perfection and in in
christ we get to kind of access that and
go back to that so
whether it is a meditation whether it is
prayer they are
engaging with their perfected self right
and um
and and i guess as they're doing it
they're becoming perfected they're
dealing with their trauma those kind of
things
um what so what about the idea of
original sin
in in that aspect that i am broken and i
need to be fixed because
you know i think for a lot of us
especially with addiction we i think we
get there eventually that was hey
something's wrong with me man like i
need help i need whether it's the trauma
whether i'm a victim
whatever it is like something's wrong so
identifying that either i'm messed up or
i've messed up or whatever the case is
so
with acknowledging that you have a
problem right that i
am broken or i need some help i need
some guidance versus like
you know god loves me the way i am and
i'm going to be this way till i die like
acknowledging the fact that something's
off
what about that right yeah and i think
that's where the paradox comes in right
because i have to
for me i had to identify where i had
separated from my original perfection
right so
um i actually believe that at the core
of each and every one of us
is this essential self now it is in my
separation from that so
i come into the world i have these
traumatic experiences
most of us weren't taught that in school
or even in church or
in our you know homes oh you're holding
perfect exactly as you are you're a
perfect emanation of source energy
most of us did not get that information
most of us were told there's something
wrong with us and we need to act a
certain way or do something
in a certain way to be worthy and so
that original separation from our true
nature
is what i think creates this idea that
we need to strive
towards something in order to be worthy
and yet
underneath all of that there's still
this whole imperfect being
so there's the the reason i use the term
paradox is i can say yes i'm a whole
imperfect being
but because i've forgotten that i don't
act that way in the world so then
there's all this evidence to support
that i'm broken or that i'm damaged in
some way and so i need to be accountable
for that
but you know any harm i've ever caused
myself
or others and god knows i have it's
always been because i had forgotten my
true
nature i believed in my own brokenness
i believed that i was a result of my
trauma
i believed that there was something
fundamentally wrong with me
in other words hurt people hurt people
right
generational trauma that gets passed
down they got
passed down through my family system on
both sides of my family
i was experiencing those and when i
believed that's who i was
i was acting that way in the world so
what we need to do obviously is be
accountable for our own behavior and our
own
that that sense of separation what that
created
but the ultimate truth is it's not who i
am it's what i have
right just like i have thoughts but i'm
not my thought so
being able to be accountable for that as
you said yeah something's not working
here but
ultimately that's not the truth
um you know having this discussion
um we seem to overcomplicate things
right we have the analytical mind
it's you know going into the psyche of
what what all this stuff represents to
us you know all that kind of stuff
that's coming up
and again we have a way of
overcomplicating it
but you know the process that you have
is is touted about
upon being simple right so like
what's simple about it versus like us
trying to you know i'm saying over
complicate things i think it's going to
take
longer than it really is that's a big
one this is going to take me years to
undo
you know but just even in the power of
prayer and
mindfulness and meditation like
instantly there's
layers that's you know i'm saying
revealed to you of just of who you
are of the breakthrough of how beautiful
you are the power that you have
all of those things how how simple are
these techniques
well as you said you know it can take a
lifetime but it can also happen in an
instant
and the the instant experience of
remembering my true nature
is what i think is different right
because even in some of the 12-step
models it's like
i need to work all of these steps so
that i can you know
become who i want to be and yes that can
be true
and at the same time in conscious
recovery i'm also recognizing that
there's this whole imperfect spiritual
being
and i can have an instant experience of
that that can happen
instantly and so how does that happen it
happens first as you said
in a very simple way this isn't a mental
process
i mean the the intellect is important
but
many of us have started to believe that
that's who we are
i am my perspectives i am my opinions we
see that in our culture running rampant
now
i am my belief system my bs belief
system
but the truth is essentially i'm
something much different
and so whether it's prayer or meditation
or spending just time in the silence or
time in nature
but i think starting with a very very
simple
yet profound knowing that
there is a whole imperfect being that in
itself creates something really
different
the foundational principle of conscious
recovery is
underneath all addictive behavior is a
whole imperfect
or an essential self that is whole and
perfect just
getting that but not just intellectually
but really
experiencing that that can create an
instant
experience that is very very different
than a lifelong process
yeah it's like layers to the onion too
right it gets deeper and deeper and
there's more and more
um now what about people who reject that
what about like people that you've tried
to work with or
or or have you who just can't believe
that because they've done
too much wrong there's people who think
that god could never forgive them
because they've just done some
despicable things and they've turned
their back and
as much as you tell them as much as you
try to work with them
to even to allow them to experience
god's love or whatever
they're just in this place of like this
idea that
that they can never be forgiven that
there's nothing good inside of them and
they'll always be
this this way they'll all you know a lot
of them feel even like
rejected by god or and god you know
i think in their mind rightfully so you
know i've done too much so
have you had those people that you you
tried to work with it where they just
they just don't get it they can't see it
oh for sure yeah absolutely because i
would say that
maybe even all of us have had that
experience right believing in our own
brokenness
in that experience of shame of that that
sense that i'm not worthy
so for me it's not really it's not
really my job to try to convince someone
that there's a place within them that's
all imperfect
but just to start to explore because
sometimes it's as simple as
do you remember a time when you felt
that or
do you look at can you look at a small
child or what i call the pre-programmed
human
right a two-year-old a three-year-old
and can you look at them
and see them as fundamentally flawed in
some way
do you remember the experience of that
and if they can get in touch with that
then the question becomes you can the
question then can become
do you think that still lives within you
somewhere and then we can become curious
about how we return to that
so sometimes people will also hear me
say
you know you just return to that place
of wholeness there's no need to do any
more work
um yes and yes we can have that
experience
and yet all of the stuff that i've done
in the world
it is important for me as you said to go
in and clean it up and do some of the
work
but i think the fundamental
knowing and not just here but really
experiencing our true nature
that fundamental shift i think creates a
really different relationship
with everything that we've done and
everything that's happened to us
because when i really understand that
the truth of who i
am is not what's happened to me the
truth of who i am is not what i've done
there's a greater reality that it makes
all that other
you know stuff that lives in relative
reality our life experience our traumas
the things that we've done the way i've
harmed myself and others
which every human being does that right
so
again i'm not sure what this you know
earth school is about
but i have a sense it's something about
us learning how to remember who we truly
are
now again we talked about you know
christianity other religions aa this
higher power that i'm getting
my source from here is that necessarily
a bad thing
if it works you know what i'm saying
versus like no you're already perfected
go within
and i know that's what you teach but
like just the idea that
i can draw i i like having an umbilical
cord
to a god that is perfect that is giving
me this perfect juice if you will that's
renewing me cleaning me i'm now
worthy because he says i'm worthy like
you know it it is external right it is
jesus that's outside of me
obviously it's christ that comes to live
within you but even that
he's come it's something external that
comes within
um is there is there problems with that
um obviously if your theology changes if
the church gets mad at you like there's
obviously stuff that can kind of come
and mess
and jack that up for you and now you're
back where you started there's a lot of
scenarios that could happen but when
it's it's external like let me connect
with god
to feel okay right and it is an
internal thing that's that's where we've
been confused it it all
it is our consciousness even if we think
it's outside of us
it really is inside of us but it's just
that
you know i'm saying the uh symbolism of
i am connecting with
like i suck but he's good but he makes
me good
because he loves me or his grace
empowers me or whatever
is that is there anything wrong with
that or if it's working for people
well yeah i like to move out of the
paradigm of good and bad and right and
wrong and ask the question what does it
create
right so i think it's wonderful if
someone has that experience
um i've had that experience i've had
that experience where it felt like
something outside of me
really helped me to feel loved again or
really helped me to feel worthy whether
that's a
human being or the idea of a higher
power
and at the same time they're not really
mutually exclusive
right so when i get in touch with my
true nature i realize
that we're all perfect expressions of
that power so regardless
of religion or not religion um because
there are all these different
paths that lead hopefully to the same
place and that place is love ultimately
right
is this helping me to be more useful on
the planet
is this helping me to love myself more
so that i can be the frequency of love
on the planet
so in that way then it's less about
the different paths or how it looks
different
it's more about like we're on this
journey together of really
learning how to reconnect with ourselves
regardless if
it has if that's through a religious
path that has you know an external
concept of a higher power or something
internal or both
really because really ultimately i think
the question
is how do i love more how do i serve
more
how can i be on this planet um tuning
out of the frequency of brokenness of
myself and the world and back into my
original perfection um and when you know
we're talking about perfection here
we're not talking about this human
perfection of doing everything perfectly
we're talking about the idea so if you
are a christian and if that is your path
then you you know that um that jesus
the christ you know because to me the
christ is a consciousness it's a
knowing right he talked about you know
the father within so
jesus was here to teach us that love is
the ultimate truth
as many other spiritual masters so then
the question
becomes less is this the right way to do
the wrong way to do it
and more about does this allow me to be
more loving in the world
in my relationships with myself in the
world
does it allow me to serve more and those
questions i think are more rich
right because i think our mind wants to
debate right is this the right path is
that the right path and instead of that
which allows
me to be more loving and more open yeah
and i think that
the biggest key again we're talking
about internal and external like
going within and without but um
the biggest thing that i think you
mentioned is just about
sitting in silence and and being okay to
be with yourself
because like you're talking about good
deeds and loving more but even
a lot of people have that contingent
upon god's grace or
i'm a good person because i help people
i'm a good person because i serve the
community or i'm helping other people
and so and that's all good but again
once that's stripped away when you're
not helping people
can you sit by yourself and still
be good right can you sit by yourself
and know that you are loved and that you
are accepted and you are whole without
i got to go here i have to support i
have to give my money i have to do this
i have to do that right because a lot of
us get caught up in that
and and and that's what makes us good is
our good deeds but
that's not the case right it's being
able to to sit with yourself
be okay know that you're loved and and
go within
and um and you have to deal with the
trauma to do that because there's
there's things that are blocking you
from doing that and that is the trauma
that is the things that come up when you
try to get quiet that monster that's
yelling
it you know it is the monster the idea
that you'll always be addicted like
we've talked about that's
for me that would be a monster you know
what i'm saying so yeah
being able to sit with yourself without
to to really step into being a human
being instead of a human doing and being
okay and knowing that you're loved and
knowing that you draw from all of this
that's not contingent upon your works
the scriptures to
teach that that's why i love them right
it's of grace it's not of works because
any man can boast who has greater works
and it's really cool i i listen to
uh and read a lot of manly p hall and he
talks a lot about how religion starts
with this
ex external exoteric and a a corporate
group or assembly of people that meet
together but eventually
it turns into this inward uh discipline
this inward journey that you have with
god and all the other beings that that
come personified as well so
knowing it is definitely about going
within i think we
can mention jesus he did that all the
time stepping away for hours
to pray and meditate and have these
spiritual experiences that
followed him because i think they were
they were doing the inner work
you know i think that they were
submitted to that process if you will
yeah and you know i mean the teachings
of jesus were really radical and they
still
are and that is that love is more
powerful than any
you know rules or laws that govern what
we call humanity right and so
i think that sometimes gets forgotten
right that that it was about love and
that it was about returning to that love
and being that love
and i really appreciate that you talked
about the doing you know in our culture
specifically in the united states we're
taught from a very
very early age that we need to do
certain things in order to be
worthy or that we need to be a doer we
start
asking our kids at a very early age what
are you going to be when you grow up
we're not really asking them what
they're going to be we're asking them
what they're going to do
right so they're supposed to answer with
a role and i remember i was supposed to
answer with a role and there were
some that were really acceptable to say
and some that weren't
and i remember there's a story of a
kindergartner that
um on the test what are you going to be
when you grow up and
the kids said happy and the teacher said
that's not that's not an acceptable
answer right so
um you know what we're saying here is
that the conscious
being leads to conscious doing right and
the more
i'm dedicated to spending time
connecting with my true nature
the more i can be beneficial on the
planet
but as you said there can be an ego trap
of i
i'm gonna become worthy because of all
these great things i'm doing
and i see people do that you know in
recovery and religion and spirituality
nothing fundamentally wrong with it but
i think what you're pointing to
is the deeper experiences let me
spend dedicated time in the silence
really knowing
my true nature who and what i really am
and then from there let me
be that in the world right let me be
that frequency of love and then that's
when it's a game changer
and that's when it goes back to a
paradox i don't need to do anything to
be
worthy but because i really understand
how worthy i am i want to do all of that
but i want to do that from the frequency
of love
not from the frequency of there's
something wrong here and i need to be a
savior i need to go in and save someone
but from a frequency just like with me
with conscious recovery
this changed my life this path of
returning to my true nature
so it's my gift to share it there's a
place within me
that knows that it's mine to give now
but
not from a place of i'm only worthy if
i can get this message out but because i
understand at a really different level
my own path toward remembering my
wholeness
then i naturally want to bring that to
the world very very different energy
yeah oh for sure um you know it
yeah i guess in a world where we're told
that again you're talking about being
accepted
if there's a lot of contingencies if
you're loved if and that gets into so
much we're talking about love and
acceptance but
we've been talking about this a lot i've
got a friend of mine who
his idea of wealth was you'll be wealthy
if or you can have money if
and it's like all of these these weird
ifs that we've
you know society or our parents have put
on us that
if we don't line up with that if then we
don't get it and so
um you know it's i had this friend who
he talked about having to apologize to
money and like
like have this this idea of like
these preconceived notions that he had
on wealth and on money that
that that weren't good that were
hindering him uh
and one and this is trauma but he uh as
a kid a bunch of his friends were going
to mcdonald's he said or going to the
store and they all had money from their
parents
and he goes to his dad and asks for five
dollars to go to the store
with his friends and his dad pulls the
money out and goes to hand it to him and
says wait
didn't you get a f on your report card
and didn't you get detention last week
you're not getting no damn money and
pulls the money back and puts it on his
pockets
in this pocket so money wealth abundance
all of that
within that five dollar notion right
there um
was the fact that he has to perform that
he has to
do good to receive or be worthy
of money and all of these these ideas
from that one
instant that's the trauma that we have
to identify like
because it's stopping you i think on
that path of that
true self love and knowing that you're
you're loved by god that's going to be
those things that pop ups hell you're
not loved you did this
and so you have to kind of get over that
you have to either see
the see yourself or that situation the
way that god sees it
which is love 100 perfect love
um getting over that and figuring out
once you're you know why are you
uncomfortable in the silence like i know
people
and these are christian well-to-do
people who like they can't be quiet they
can't sit still
because their thoughts and their past
and every all the trauma it's it's
overwhelming
so they always have to be doing
something whether it's preaching whether
it's teaching whether it's
you know talking administering somebody
even on the telephone and all
they're never just in that place of
perfect peace because
you have to deal with the things i mean
you know going back to again
like the psychedelic stuff like you have
to deal with the things that you've been
suppressing
once you stay once you're in this place
of like doing that inner work
the stuff that you've been suppressing
for 20 years five years
this week it's coming up you got to deal
with it
and so uh but it's good it's we need to
deal with it right because
we're responding to people situations
uh out of hurt and out of resentment
that um
you know it's unfair to those people you
know that we judge and we have
preconceived notions because of
something somebody did to us
20 years ago or whatever you know yeah
absolutely and you're speaking to
something that's so
important because like let's imagine
your friend
in that moment he there was not just a
belief that was created there was an
experience right so money is connected
somehow to the idea of worthiness
so i i'm bad so i don't deserve money
right now an intellectual understanding
of that isn't actually going to shift
that
that's just going to be an understanding
of that and i think that's why people
can spend 20 years in therapy
um with understanding the patterns or
this came from my parents or this was a
belief system that i picked up
but i think the fundamental question is
how do we actually start to shift that
and so if we remember our little self
that had that experience we can start to
care for that little self so
when i was five years old i decided i
was stupid i won't get into the story
but it was one of those moments in that
exact way
and so i understood that that was the
moment i decided i was stupid but just
understanding that intellectually wasn't
going to change that
what i had to do and what we do in
conscious recovery
is we really start to integrate and take
care of that little five-year-old that
decided i was stupid
how do i start to care for and allow
that five-year-old to feel um you've
talked about it throughout the show
today that the emotion
that is attached to that that's really
what we need to
create a space where it's safe to start
feeling
and many of us men get this more
more in our culture but everyone gets it
on some level it's not okay to feel
maybe you grew up in a family where it
wasn't okay to be angry
or maybe people weren't really talking
about what was happening
in my family it was go to your room and
so you can stop
crying or let me give you something so
you stop having this feeling
so from a very early age it's not really
okay for us to be present with what's
happening internally
so a huge part of recovery is
integrating
re-parenting allowing ourselves to be
present with what is
and as you've said there are a lot of
people
that are running from the experience of
simply being alone with ourselves so
that alone being able to be present with
ourselves
sitting in the silence noticing what
comes up
you know i think a lot of us have an
idea that meditation is supposed to be
we sit and we have this experience of
bliss that does happen sometimes but it
also might be just as useful
to have a meditation where i notice i'm
agitated
but guess what i learned how to be
present with that agitation for 10
minutes
that can be profound that's big and
i guess that leads us to our next
question you're kind of answering as we
go along but christie is asking a
question here says
how can a person get in touch with their
spiritual side with a few practical
steps
what would you tell them i think a
little bit of all of this which you've
been sharing kind of
uh implies right
well yeah absolutely i mean part of it
is um learning to be in the silence but
as i said it's not necessarily about
let me try to quiet the mind because
that's what i was hearing when i first
started meditating i don't know if
that's what was being
said or that's just what i heard but i
heard the intention of
meditation is to quiet the mind but when
i
understood that mindfulness or
meditation was really a practice of
learning to be with myself
then i that was a game changer because i
thought i can set the timer for 10 or 15
minutes and just be present with what is
so it's recognizing or tuning into the
original frequency
i think eckhart tolle uses the practice
of
feeling the energy field beneath the
skin right can i get in touch with an
energy field that i am can i get in
touch with the frequency of love can i
become curious
another practice that's really practical
for for your your listener
the viewer is to ask questions
so i use this um process called living
in the question
it's something we do unconscious
recovery i choose an open-ended question
and i just sit with that throughout the
day maybe it's for 15 minutes on
meditation
maybe i take a walk in nature and ponder
the question
maybe i look in the mirror and ask my
question over and over again
an open-ended question like what else is
possible today
um where did i first get this idea
what else is possible for me how does it
get even better than this
i remember at a time where i was using
the open
open-ended question where can i be most
useful today
and i would just live in that question
so sometimes it's about questioning the
beliefs that that have been you know put
on top of the original experience so i
hope
that those are tangible in in terms of
how do we get in touch with our true
nature
it's almost seems like it's just a
process of exploring mindfulness right
being mindful of
these the you know the things we've been
suppressing right
yeah yeah being aware trying to do
things
you know so we don't have to think about
it you know
yeah a wise teacher once said there are
three steps to it awareness awareness
and awareness
yeah it's huge and um and just to
explore that
see how it feels being able to sit with
yourself knowing that you're loved
knowing that there is bliss you are
connected to it as a
you know um umbilical cord
to god but it's within you know you are
you are already there and so
sometimes we just need to be aware of
that because the like when you put your
awareness on it
you immediately attract it into your
life
and then when you once you identify then
once you speak it then once you
acknowledge it you know um then you
create it in in your life whether that's
peace whether that's
you know financial security like what it
works for everything you know it
definitely works with trauma it
definitely works with the things that
you've been suppressing but
your future setting yourself up like the
desires of your heart
like don't try to you know suppress them
because they're too big your dreams are
too big so let's not speak on them let's
not tell it
tell anybody right let's actively
explore this stuff
and be mindful of it and uh and see and
see how it takes to get there like once
you once you're able to do that then
i feel like there are different steps
that present themselves to you
on how to attract that into your life
whether it's like
you know you you get offended easily
okay if
you first if you're mindful that hey
that's a character flaw that's something
that's going on
every time somebody you know disagrees
with me i get offended
let me first of all acknowledge it and
then try to trace it back and then i
feel like god the universe
shows you ways to deal with it the
reason
you're offended is because you don't
want to be proven wrong it's because
this happened whatever the case is and
so being able to trace that stuff back
on how we can
work with god to deal with that stuff
and move it out the way so that there
are no blockages with us um
communicating engaging with our
perfected self which is who we already
are
yeah absolutely and being able to
recognize
that we can only step into the life we
believe we deserve
but that's about 100 of the time right i
can only step into the life i believe i
deserve
so if you're looking at an example of
easily offended
i think the questioning process can be
really powerful here
and that is when did this first start in
my life and if i can start to remember
a time when i felt like i needed to
defend myself for a time that i
felt that i had to have the right answer
you know we live in a very
answer focused culture and i think
questions are much more important than
answers and right now in our culture
we're seeing this
elevated or ramped up with social media
and the opinionating you know you
mentioned trolls right so
this whole idea that we are our opinions
and we need to get our our opinion
across
and to me um it goes back to the
experience of learning how to be present
with myself
someone says something i notice an
internal reaction
can i be present with this rather than
trying to deflect
because there's an instantaneous i feel
better if i push this off on you
but what happens when i really recognize
what just got touched what's happening
internally can i learn how to be present
with this
and then the the behavior of needing to
opinionate
actually starts to dissipate on its own
yeah
yeah yeah it's uh i've definitely uh
you know been practicing that for a
couple years now but you still find
times where like people
you know lash out at you or push those
buttons and you're you find yourself
your blood begins to boil whether it's
somebody on facebook or something like
hold on
but the whole thing is that you're able
to recognize it like yeah it's happening
the cool thing is that you you notice it
happening
whereas in the past when you wasn't
mindful you just did it like a robot you
didn't even know that you were doing it
but now that you're mindful now you can
identify it and deal with it
or or you know i'm saying withdraw from
it and not follow
that to whatever bridge you're about to
burn you know what i'm saying
so being mindful of it is key and even
when people wrestle with it
but they're mindful of it they don't
know how to overcome it they don't know
but but you see it like that's huge you
got to understand
like most people don't see it they don't
know that they're doing these things
they don't know that they're running
awesome people out of their life
they don't know that they're you know
doing all of this they have these
character flaws that are
hurting them but even though you you're
doing it too the fact that you can see
it it's like hold on
like it it it makes way for course
correction
that you can change it that you can stop
doing it and and learn what
what are the routes that that are
causing you to act this way to respond
this way so i think they're in a good
place you know um
you know even with the god thing i
remember you know my friend years ago
just talking about how
in literally this guy he thought god
would never forgive him god doesn't love
him and all this kind of stuff
is like you know the fact that you still
feel sorry about the things that you've
done
like the fact that you know that you've
made some mistakes that's huge
because you got people who don't even
think they did anything wrong
the fact that you're grieving in your in
your your conscious of these things
are the proof that god is still dealing
with you and he still loves you
if that was the case you wouldn't even
care you'd be able to do evil and do
wickedness and
you know mess over people and not even
care about it like literally there's
people who do that
we can't fathom that because we have a
conscious like we feel bad about
you know doing wrong to other people but
there are people who
don't feel anything about it so the fact
that you're conscious of
anything it is it shows that there is
progress being made
and there's and god's not done with you
you know
yeah and when going back to like the the
thing about like the reaction to the
opinions because we see
that a lot i think what you're pointing
to something that's really important is
i first must recognize that it's not
what i'm reading or what someone's
saying to me it's the wound that's
getting touched
you know so it's not your words that
hurt me it's that you've touched an
unhealed wound
and that's the great news the great news
is getting touched because
as you said i'm aware of this and that's
the first step i'm aware that this is
happening
but the key here is that it's mine not
yours
you did not hurt me your words are not
hurting me
even if it feels directed at me i can
say
wow something is getting touched within
me and it's getting touched for my
healing
so then i can be curious about that i
could start asking the question
what is wanting to heal right now so if
i notice myself wanting to lash out
because
as you said you know all of us have this
experience of
oh that just touched something but when
i realized
that it's mine then i can say oh what's
wanting to heal right now
and then i don't find myself wanting to
lash out because first of all i know
that it's futile it doesn't do anything
but keep it alive
so the fundamental question is do i want
to be right or do i want to be free
right would i rather be free in this
moment would i rather be
in joy or do i want to constantly live
in my reactive mind which is just
creating
more division in my life more separation
more duality
or do i want to actually live in the
frequency of love
it's the ego you know the ego serves the
purpose and um
it's trying to protect you you know it's
trying to protect you from
a lot of different things but in the in
but you find that
in the end it's making more problems for
you when the ego is trying to protect
you from hurt it's trying to protect you
from bad friends and
gossip and ridicule and from stepping
out but you find out that
once you allow it to do what it does
like it it pretty much stifles you
it hinders you so having to be mindful
of
those feelings that come up are good
because the fact like you're saying like
these are open wounds triggers are
awesome
triggers are amazing it shows you that
you have an
open wound what happens if somebody's
cut and you touch the open wound they
jump so hold on this this trigger i've
just been triggered because you touched
and a wound that is not yet healed so
pay attention to the triggers you know
don't don't just dive into them
but pay attention to them and and see
how that you can be healed from it
how can you minister forgiveness to that
area of your life
you know or to extending it to someone
else that has wronged you like
all of these things are i feel like are
part of the process of dealing with
those
own inner wounds and um you know a lot
of
a lot of people like we won't we won't
last out of other people
and we won't take out our hatred or uh
you know uh
self-worth and all that stuff on other
people but we don't project it's
we're cutting ourselves man like we are
like
spiritual cutters if you will that we we
want to feel that pain and stuff and so
just having those open wounds there's a
lot of people who
um you know they they're well-to-do
people because they don't mess with
anybody but
the pain and infliction that they cause
upon themselves is
uh devastating so we got to be mindful
that we we're going through that process
so that we can heal ourselves
so that we can in turn heal the world
yes and i love that you use the word
trigger because
in conscious recovery i actually change
some of the commonly used language and i
change the word trigger
to activation and the reason that i do
that is a lot of times we'll talk about
triggers and we usually talk about it as
an external event
but what i hear you saying is let's be
more curious about what got
touched so i use the word activation
because
when someone does something or something
happens in my life
and i call it a trigger i might think
well the solution is to change the
trigger or to
move away from the trigger that's why we
hear people talking about toxic work
environments toxic relationships how do
i
wean myself off of or get rid of these
relationships but the
real relationship is the relationship
with self
and when i become when i recognize that
it's not the trigger but it's what got
activated that's when i can start to
heal that that's when i can start to
become much more
curious about what got activated rather
than the triggering
incident so if you look at it through
the lens of
addiction and recovery um you know you
were talking about the ego
being the protector that's the same for
addiction
right substance use whatever our
addiction is
that is something that's trying to
protect us and it has worked well
to a certain extent but it really isn't
serving us so
in that way we get more curious about
what's happening internally
than what the external or the triggering
event is that's good
um got a question here and i think we
kind of touched on this a little bit
maybe
um but maybe it's a little different but
this is from clint clinton says
i created uh at an early age a character
that
talks guide and talks and guides me
but when i see it i see another version
of me
in front of me that has more knowledge
on how to love
and being all in oneself is that healthy
because i don't always trust that other
guy in myself
yeah i love that because you're
acknowledging that there's a place
within you that is very wise right there
is the place within me
and within all of us that has that
wisdom
and and creating a character of the wise
one within i think is really great
because
it's almost like i can look at this as a
another being even though it's actually
something
within me now the trust is another
question
right and so a lot of us learn how
whether we use the framework of listen
to god or listen to the inner voice or
listen to the frequency of the universe
hearing it and trusting it are two
different things right
and so some of it is just you know we do
hear that wisdom comes with age and i
think for me what that's been about is
i've learned that when i trust that
deeper inner knowing
that voice that guides me when i trust
that
things are much easier and i move more
toward the life i want
i start to through experience trust that
so then i can
ask myself let's imagine it's a
character the wise one
oh yeah when i listen to the wise one
life turns out a whole lot better than
it does
when i listen to the narrative of i'm
broken they're broken something's wrong
here
so just being aware of that we keep
going back to that but being aware
of what happens when i trust that
character that lives within me
or that one it's almost like the old
angel and devil on our shoulder
there's a reason for that right we do
all have this internal conflict on some
level of
whether we call it good bad right wrong
or just this knowing
that i have this voice within me that
will guide me in a really positive
direction
it's interesting man i i like to study
personas right
and and having that other character
we're talking about and
whether they're multiple personalities
whether they serve you like whether
they're healthy i think it's all
debatable but
we see a lot of people doing it i know
we you know in the spiritual circles we
deal with a lot of psychics and
channelers you know
and there's people who channel certain
beings and i did this study in this
video on just the idea of what if that
being is just another aspect of yourself
that you're channeling
because you don't feel like you have the
answers
but so and so does let me channel him
when deep down you you you really do
have the answers you have
insight whether you whether it helps you
get into a place where you separate
yourself from your carnal mind to
a higher mind or whatever just to see
how that operates and to to be
in that self and some people can do it
without like
start stepping into a character a lot of
people change their voices
and hello everyone i am here to minister
you know and
they have that it's a persona it's a
step when i put this
garment on i am the minister when i when
we take it off hey i'm me again you know
that kind of thing so
obviously whether that's something
psychological that goes on within our
heads but i think
everyone does it we may not give them
give it a name
some of us do i remember when i was a
little kid we would play basketball
and i would pick a basketball care a
player
that i wanted to play like for the day
and i and it would it would i would
change my
it would change the way i played the
game uh because i knew what
like his attributes what was associated
with this guy
this guy does a lot of this certain move
and a lot of reverse layups
this other guy when i'm dennis rodman
i'm i'm getting nothing but rebounds
every rebound that comes off the
backboard i'm getting it
i am taking on literally that persona
in my head to start playing like that
individual and you know there's
we do it by default we may not give it a
name we may not say we're becoming this
person but
a lot of us do it without even knowing
knowing it so i wonder
if it can be healthy if we know it it
gets into a lot of weird stuff
like tulpas and creating entities that
eventually get a mind of their own
and that you probably get into some kind
of like demon stuff that comes in there
too right when these when it's a
negative
attributes that have a mind of its own
but it's really interesting to again
explore
consciousness and find out how these
different
ideas and and things are serving us like
that served me in a good way it did it
could create a split personality
while i was playing basketball you know
because but it served me
but when i'm at home you know doing
something else
this i wasn't even thinking about it you
know it's deep
i think i love what i love what you're
saying because then i can become
curious right i wonder if this is an
aspect of myself
i wonder if that each and every one of
us has all of that within us
what would get what how would the world
change in this moment
if each of us acknowledged that we are
capable of everything that we see
right it's something that's within me
and then i can start to have more
compassion for myself and others
and then as you said i can become
curious of am i channeling
another entity maybe or is this also an
aspect of myself
is are the answers within me and again
the paradox yes
they're within me but i also for
whatever reason need other human
connection or other relationships to
help myself get clear on that
yeah um i mean i think it goes back to
again to the idea that there is a
perfected self within you
uh a self that's that has everything you
that knows everything that's loved a
perfect love
and if you don't believe it you can't
engage with it but it's the fact that
you you believe it and maybe even
through the belief that you create it
and it serves you because there's this a
perfect you that doesn't need to perform
that doesn't have to earn love and i can
be that person
you got to be mindful of it because the
moment that you're not mindful of it you
may
you know this world is set up with
systems and colors and lights and
and programming to program us into
other well realms and ways of thinking
that are detrimental to our health
to sell us stuff you know and so yes
i find the idea very interesting too and
i laughed a while ago when you kind of
talked about a little bit about in this
other you that's inside of you kind of
thing
with the fact of again from the
christian belief there is like the
mystery of the gospel and of the bible
and what it means and it said the
mystery of jesus is the fact that
there's christ in me the hope of glory
of like jesus is
in you if you believe it and you receive
it and so you allow this part of
yourself
that loves everybody that's going to
turn the other cheek
that's going to bless them that curse
you that's not going to seek revenge
over stupid petty stuff like
you know what i'm saying that does good
deeds simply because he loves
everyone and it's not a jesus outside of
you but a jesus within you
this good aspect of yourself that's in
everyone
you just don't know how to connect with
it you've never been told i mean this is
an aspect of
everyone can connect with and the other
sides are in there too
the demons the devil the satan if it's
not within you
it's definitely not without you all of
that stuff is taking place
within us and it's when we feed it and
we guide it and we can interact
and and it's beautiful because we like
to look at things outside of us and i
think it helps us right we are
definitely you know we're helping with
with uh
ritual and you know being able to see
things that remind us of things
inwardly we see a cross an image of a
cross that reminds us of
what he did for me that's something he
did just for me or whatever
we see colors we do rituals we wear
jewelry esoteric symbolism
it reminds us of a deep spiritual truth
that is already
within us not without without us that's
that's right and when and you know in my
first book conscious being i actually
lay out
different levels of conscious awareness
where we do
have the external back to the internal
right because it can be a journey for us
i might first live in the level of
consciousness that that everything is
outside of me and that what i see is the
only reality and
all those programs i've been taught i
might you know feel like a victim to the
world
but as i grow and evolve i start to
recognize that there are different
levels of awareness
and ultimately we come to a place where
we realize it's all within us
and i'm literally projecting onto the
world right so the more i know that i am
love the more i see the world as loving
the more i know that i
am peace the more i see peace in the
world
so we start to experience our core
vibration
you know we talk a lot in our culture
now about attracting the law of
attraction
and i actually am changing that to the
law of radiance can i
be the love that i want to see can i be
the peace that i'm looking for
then when i am literally vibrating in
that frequency i'm actually radiating
that into the world
and then i see it everywhere right
because what i'm experiencing
externally is really a projection a
projection of what i'm experiencing
internally and then i can start to
become curious about
what is the life i want to create and
how do i start tuning into a different
frequency within me so that i can start
to experience life in a new and
different way
yeah and that's that really is the key
to um
everything as far as your happiness you
know being content manifestation
whatever is about you know and that
that's what our spiritual
our spiritual reality is somebody was in
my inbox the other day
and was asking me a little bit about
that this very thing and was asking
like am i more of a idealist
and i had to really look it up to see
like what he was projecting of like the
definition of what that means or
whatever
like seeing things that the way that
they should be versus the way that they
are
but it works hand in hand like because
you know
if you change the way that you look at
things the things that you look at
change and if your spirituality
your mindset is not practical where it's
having real world
real world implications then it's it's
in vain
so but all of that starts within and
that on your own
inner journey and the way that you view
things the way that you view
everything people you know again i'm
talking about religion
other religions god like christians
you know gay people you know what i'm
saying like everybody has different ways
that
we have this prejudice because of the
ways that that we were raised and we all
have to be mindful and all have to undo
that stuff
um to so that we can make sure that
we're not being influenced by
these out outside sources that don't
have your best interest in mind
right right and we're all victims to it
without a doubt yeah
and the question i always ask going back
to is what does it create when i believe
this
right what does it create in my life
when i believe this what would it
be like what would it feel like if i
were to be free from that
what would get created if i were to be
more open to a different point of view
you know we see that in politics right
now just so much finger-pointing
what if i can be more open what if i can
be more curious
rather than um thinking that i have the
answer or that the way i was programmed
to believe is the ultimate truth
yeah it's a truth in relative reality
and we all see it differently so let me
be curious about this
rather than thinking i have the answer
yeah it's huge
and um you know uh even with this
podcast i talked to so many people
from all walks of life and all
backgrounds and and the listeners are
are the same right all eclectic walks of
life and backgrounds and um
there's some interesting things that i
hear that i that i don't really resonate
with it could be
you know they could be scary like there
was just one lady it was just this
stands out for some reason years a
couple years ago
she was talking she was in a
relationship with a being from
uh the octurians or something like that
uh um a star command that she was in a
romantic relationship with an off-world
entity and
but i could see what it was doing in her
and now she doesn't need acceptance and
need outside it was
you know you could you tell those things
it's like i don't know how
you know i don't know if it's real i
don't know if she's making it up if she
is she really in this relationship
but at this point it's like i want to
see the fruit and what is producing
like what like your truth your reality
is
is delusions for other people if they've
never experienced it they have no grid
of understanding but what is the fruit
from it uh there was a
a preacher that i used to listen to a
lot and he said they may disagree with
your doctrine
and your belief systems and stuff but
they can't disagree with your love
as long as like love is is is coming out
of you
and that's your fruit what you because
your beliefs
prove um your your
your actions prove what you believe if
there's any validity to it if it's real
if there's repeatability
like a bunch of interesting things so
i'm in in a place where like
like i'm cool with it like if you if
that's what you believe first of all i
don't know that it's not real
like i don't know that you're not that
he's not visiting you in the astral
realms and
y'all are married and have big kids on
other planets like that's what they
i don't know that and i don't know if
it's not healthy because it's not my
truth i've never experienced it
i do have to approach it from this place
of letting me see where you're coming
from
and that's what then i know that's an
extreme example right but there's a
all of us have those examples you know
within our own lives and they may not
seem
as extreme but but they are you know
what i'm saying
yeah and we get it's so easy to get
caught up in all of that
instead of asking the fundamental
question that you just asked
in some way and that is can i be the
frequency of love today
what would it take for me to be more the
frequency of love the frequency of peace
and what gets created when i tune into
that
instead of all the different you know um
belief systems or the theologies or the
doctrines
yeah yeah because they're endless
yeah yeah it never ends and then and
then maybe it's as profoundly as simple
as how can i be
more the frequency of love today what
would it take for me maybe that's the
question to live in
i think it is it's definitely my answer
you know and what i'm
and i think you know what i believe that
is and what that looks like
maybe it's different for everybody but
but love and um
and and just our definition of of you
know
treating people how you want to be
treated you know similar
experiences but which is you know the
the
the height of my spirituality if if
we're becoming more loving
if we're you know these these
mindfulness and meditations like
asking love to come you know into your
heart and and becoming love to others
and
becoming of service and things like that
so which against
there is no doctrines right there is no
rules or regulations nobody can judge
that they're they they you can't
disagree with that
because it is love and so hopefully that
challenges other people man just to step
out and find
if there's any belief systems if there's
any doctrines or dogmas that are that's
pushing you
away from love whether it's politics
like you know
turn it off you know what i'm saying if
there's any outside sources of family
members
that are you know causing um division
and
um pushing you away from love being
being loved
in your own life in every area man every
area so
tj man i really enjoyed this episode bro
thanks for coming on hanging out with me
uh if people are um interested about
your work and and they want to book a
session with you they want to they want
to read your book and get trained in all
this stuff
or is a good place for them to to
connect with you
tjwoodward.com i have some online
amazing online courses
my books my workbooks all of that you
can find on tjwoodward.com and
thank you so much i loved our
conversation today and anytime i can be
in the conversation
about how we can be the frequency of
love because the truth is that's how we
can actually start to change the world
we don't change the world through
fighting resisting and trying to get our
point across
but through being this frequency and
more and more of us are tuning into it i
just feel like we're on
we're in a time of rapid acceleration of
a transformation on the planet so
thank you for having this as a platform
to speak to that
hey thanks so much for hanging out with
me really enjoyed it um
have you been to michael beck um michael
beckwith's church
i've seen you've done some stuff with
him or on this podcast have you been oh
yeah
so so i'm actually ordained by michael
so michael and i are friends and
i've done some work with him and
collaborated with him and
yeah i started the first satellite of
agape up here in the bay area
about two years ago so it's in it's in
oakland i mean now it's virtually but
yeah we we were honored that he asked us
to be the very first agape satellite
and his vision is to have agape's all
over the world now so
i'm grateful to be part of you know
helping that because he is a
on fire with a powerful message and i'm
really really grateful
for my connection with him oh so awesome
man good stuff man thanks for coming on
hanging out with me man
i'm sure we'll connect again thank you
so much thank you
thanks peace many blessings bro tj
woodward ladies and gentlemen
conscious recovery consciousness is
powerful being conscious of
everything being conscious of love that
that you are loved like
like what what can they there is no
greater you know law than the law of
love
i mean the beautiful thing again jesus
taught this stuff man
and it's so funny how we get all kinds
of other messages out of
the message of christ outside of love
you know what i'm saying um when we like
to debate
and point fingers and who's right and
who's wrong and all this stuff but
you know christ talked about that all of
the law and all of the prophets the
entire bible
all of it everything every jot and every
tittle all of it hangs upon love
to love the lord your god with all your
heart all your mind all your soul all
your being
and to love your neighbor as yourself if
you do those two things
love god honor god love people honor
people
then you fulfill the the entire
entirety of the law that's what when i
came
into that revelation that's what set me
free from like trying to keep
commandments and thinking that
inwardly it comes with it it's pride
that comes with it but you think that
like you're closer to god than other
people
um you think that you're doing something
to be accepted of god
and that's that's not that's not the way
um
it's a it's of grace it's the free gift
of grace
uh by faith faith is believing in it you
don't have it unless you believe it you
have to believe to receive
activating your faith that you are loved
that you
are accepted that god has
a beautiful plan for you to prosper you
to bless you not to harm you
um listen we're talking about this
aspect of you that exists that is all of
those things
the things that you don't like like
there's an aspect of you that is already
in you
you're not becoming you already are
you're not going to be it's already in
there
you just got to find the ways to get it
out speaking to it
identifying it seeing it introducing
yourself
as that whatever it is to create that
life that you want for yourself
and a lot of people look at that as far
as like we're dealing with manifestation
with money and finances and wealth and
careers and all and all you know all
that stuff but
an aspect of you that loves more
the aspect of you that
gives more the aspect of you that is
present
against such there is no love it's there
it's it's for you you're not becoming
you already are that stuff is not you're
not going to
receive it outside of you it's already
in you if you've dreamed it
if you can think about it it's already
in there the process is how do we get it
out
and i think that it is through
mindfulness i think that it is through
meditation i think that it is
through prayer see that stuff activates
it
which you already are is already there
you may not see
the results of it until you start taking
steps in that direction
until you start saying yes to the call
right and that's a process manifestation
is definitely a process
seed time and harvest it's all it's
always going to be in the earth
so there's going to be a time where you
have to plant the seed
you have to first you got to dig the
ground dig the hole
put the seed in cover it up water it
make sure it's getting proper sunlight
make sure it's starting to grow
get all the weeds from around it like
there's process in that
for everything in your life it's not
instant but you got to stick to it you
can't just put that seed down and leave
if you're lucky even something might
come up
but you have to tend to it you have to
sit there and work on it you have to you
have to fight for it
like it's hard just to put something out
there and hope that it prospers and just
and leave and go and that's what we're
doing with life that's what we're doing
with
with careers that's what what we're
doing with vision putting seeds in the
ground and not
and not cultivating it a seed might take
six months to sprout
to to see anything to show people
there's proof i put something in the
ground
you gotta you gotta attend to it so uh
and that's applicable with you know
being consistent consistency is key
for everything for love for for
graduating this
this earth school saying yes and
responding with love that never gets old
that's always the answer
all the way down you know you can go on
your test and mark the answers
that's always it trust and responding
with love
trusting god again going back what jesus
says loving god
loving god is that you trust him look i
trust you i'm okay
i'm gonna make it i'm okay you ain't let
me down yet
ain't gonna let me down now there's this
place of that view that is already
that's always connected
and you can draw from it at any time
for every reason in your life to get
god's perspective
which is love which is not degrading
it's not condemnation the bible says
there was no condemnation for those who
are in christ jesus
as far as i'm concerned being in christ
jesus is being in love
perfect love that's who jesus is
is love that became a man you can change
that word out
god is love he's also this and that
brother he's judgment he's
retribution too man listen
he's whatever you want him to be
on top of that he says i am i am that i
am a higher usher a higher i am that i
am and i will be whatsoever i will be
he's like whatever you need me to be
i'll be it
do you need me to be this yes do you
need me to be that yet whatever you
think i am i
am that to you if you think that god is
just this
uh vengeful you know
person father figure that just reigns on
your parade he's ready to
to bash you over the head when you get
it get it wrong in life
like he is that because you believe it
you've created a god it is idolatry
honestly it's idolatry because you've
created an
image uh in in the form of this god that
that's not
what i believe to be the true guy which
is love peace
justice all of that stuff comes in the
into play but
it's a form of idolatry because
you're like it's it's really pagan tree
because you're
giving your the actual uh attributes of
your father
your dad or your mom to god
you don't even know it because your dad
wanted you to perform your dad wanted
you to get everything right
so now we kind of put that off on god
god wants us to perform god wants us to
get everything right
that's not that's not the truth man
that's so you know we we project
we're projecting into the world we're
projecting on god we're projecting on
uh all types of people groups and
and and looking for reasons to be
offended and looking for reasons for
uh for people to be wrong listen gotta
be mindful of it
i'm saying it so you'll be mindful of it
i definitely had to be mindful of it
i'm starting with myself because i've
unrecognized character flaws within me
and there's character flaws and there's
things that god has to get out of you to
get to those next levels you can't bring
it with you
it's too heavy it's dense it belongs at
the lower levels you can't
you can't keep eating second grade lunch
you know what i'm saying
at you know in high school or in college
like you got to get rid of that stuff
leave it on second grade don't
try to bring it with you it can't go up
there
and that's it that's for spiritual
reasons
it's truth anyhow so look man thank you
guys for hanging out i really enjoyed
connecting with this brother today
uh conscious recovery check out his his
work uh
his book and all this good stuff will be
in the description
and uh the links of of this video and
all that good stuff so
check that out um again if you guys have
not had a chance to get a free copy of
my audiobook
you can get that by going to the links
as well if you click the audible trial
link
you get a free copy of my audiobook and
it gives me a kickback
on all the downloads and all the signups
and it doesn't even cost you anything
you have to sign up you have to put a
card in but you
it doesn't charge you and you can cancel
right after and you still get the book
and 30 days free win-win situation
make sure you do that check it out
people are begging me for the for the
audiobook i put out the physical they're
like no i don't want the physical man i
i don't read physical books do the audio
okay i didn't want to i did it i did it
for you man
did it for you it was a long strenuous
process took a while to
to uh be here three three months in the
making almost and now it's finally here
so
if you want a copy of it go get it it's
free why not so the information is there
there's no reason that
that you can't uh get a copy of this so
that's there
it's still available on physical still
available on kindle
all the other places as well so make
sure you check it out
um so uh nissa says amen thanks bro can
we get a book
ask paperback i don't have audible yep
yeah that links in the description as
well so you just go
and uh it's on amazon so i think when
you go to the amazon link that it uh
it shows you the audible first but
they're all connected you just pick
which one you want
if it's the paperback or um
all the audio version or kindle so you
just pick it there so yeah it is
available on amazon
as well um been working hard on a lot of
new stuff messing with some new music
there's some
new music already on the patreon um
doing our prayer session tonight i don't
know if we're gonna do some breath work
got a meditation really don't know
really don't have a vision yeah i
usually try to listen to the lord what
he wants to do for the day and so
um i usually craft the meditation or
focus on that area whatever i'm feeling
so
we'll see what happens we always have
fun that's for sure so if you want to
get access to our school of the mystics
thursday night sessions
make sure you join on via patreon you
get access for a dollar
so it's not too expensive so everybody
can afford that
and if you can't talk to me if there's
some reason that you can't afford a
dollar
we need to talk and uh i'll try to help
you out and do whatever i can so
um that's available last week uh
we did the prayer session right we're
just doing a
private prayer session on uh uh our dis
or um not discord but uh zoom and we had
about 14 people in there
and i was gonna record it
and you know upload it to uh whether i
put it on youtube or put it on um
um this patreon for people to go back
and listen to
uh i accidentally clicked start
streaming so i thought i pushed record
but i clicked stream and so
we're about you know 45 minutes into it
and we're taking prayer requests and
somebody's like you know you're live on
youtube right so me and my wife are
sitting here we're leading meditation
and we're tapping into prayer with
everybody
and uh i looked over and it's like i
think we had 20 people watching on
on youtube and then we had um
at least at least that's what it said
like there was like over 100 something
before the stream was done but um
all these people were watching and then
there's a whole bunch of prayer requests
coming through so i was like oh wow
why not so it was a pleasant surprise
like i've been wanting to to do that to
to
do our um you know live stream prayer
sessions again taking prayers and
just being there for people um on the
live stream been super busy and then
what you know we have stuff that's you
know for the memberships and stuff like
that that we we do too on thursday so
i was like you know what so the people
who were
the patrons who were hanging out with us
on discord and zoom or whatever like
they still got something
special they got to hang out after and
uh
and we had good conversation even after
that so that's probably what we'll do
i'll probably live stream it i don't
know but i definitely uh
you know give something special for
those who who hang around who are there
um we'll hang out after and have
conversations so if you're looking for
conversation with like-minded people
we have a really cool community some
really eclectic awesome people so
uh make sure that you you tap in with us
through that again it's a dollar
you know if you can't do it holler at me
we'll make it happen
um speaking of prayer there's somebody
here in and i don't know if michael
or michelle michelle is uh um
still watching or not but asking for
prayer so i'll make sure that
i pray and i'll actually end out with
prayer too for you and for anybody
who is um in in need of of prayer so uh
i do that because i know that a lot of
people you know listen to the podcast
and
they tap into what we're doing and for
many people this is their church
you know whether their church is closed
because of covet or
they just looking for a like-minded
community who who are just open to uh
to discuss other ideas and topics and
you're not going to get kicked out
for believing something different you're
not going to be kicked out for wearing a
certain shirt
you're not going to be kicked out
because you let the curse word slip
whatever these crazy reasons you get
kicked out of churches for these days
it's not going to happen here so um you
know i do i do know that that people see
this as their church so
and they want prayer so i'll definitely
uh say a prayer lift people up we all
need it
right i don't think anybody is above
reproach i don't think that anybody
is in a place where you don't need it
you're just good you know you can use it
i can use it for sure so i'm going to
pray
michelle essary asking god to free me
from addictions
could use prayer for that please i've
never asked anyone to pray for that for
me but i'm struggling with it
it's time for it to end alright so we'll
bless you out with that
father i just thank you that your grace
and your love is what enables us to step
into freedom
so right now for michelle whatever she's
dealing with any of those
uh addictions what is the root cause of
it
let you just send forth your peace right
now
all the way to the root and remove it
uproot it get it out the hurt the
unforgiveness the bitterness
the rejection all of it sending peace
peace peace right now
removing it right now
to be perfect to be okay to be
comfortable
in her skin and the idea of
who you are even without that addiction
who you are without the hurt without the
trauma
you're blessed you're loved you're
accepted
not because what you do not because of
what you did
it's because god's love for you extends
to you
right now send forth peace to michelle
and anyone else listening who just needs
an extra touch
he just needs some